We keep hearing that COVID doesn’t discriminate, but the data shows that, here in Washtenaw County, it’s disproportionately the black residents of Ypsilanti who are suffering

As of yesterday at 3:00 PM, 14,225 residents of Michigan were known to have contracted COVID-19, with 540 of those cases being in Washtenaw County. [At the same time, there had been 540 deaths in Michigan from COVID-19, with 8 of those having been in Wasthenaw County.] Of those currently hospitalized in Washtenaw County, the largest contingents are from Ypsilanti and Ypsilanti Township. Here, from the Washtenaw County Health Department, is the breakdown. [Ypsilanti’s zip codes are 48198 and 48197.]

So, while only 29% of the County’s population lives in Ypsilanti [Township and City], a full 45% of those hospitalized for COVID-19 are from here. This is significant. Also significant is the fact that a huge percentage of those who have been hospitalized in Washtenaw County are black.

Across the entire County, 51% of those hospitalized are black, whereas only 41% are white. This, of course, is significant because the population of the County is only 12.3% black, and 74.1% white.

And this disproportionate impact on black citizens isn’t just happening here in Washtenaw County. ProPublica is reporting that, “In Michigan, where the state’s population is 14% black, African Americans made up 35% of cases and 40% of deaths as of Friday morning.” And it looks as though other states are seeing the same thing happen.

As for why this is happening, here’s an excerpt from a statement released by the Washtenaw County Health Department.

…Due to structural and environmental racism, African Americans are more likely to have underlying health conditions like heart disease, asthma, and diabetes, and are less likely to have access to healthcare in both Washtenaw County and across the country. These factors may be able to explain some, but not all of the disparate effects coronavirus is having on our African American communities.

Additional societal and economic factors may also be putting people of color and low-income individuals in our community at greater risk of infection. Across the country, Black and Latino workers are more likely to work in lower-wage service, production, and transportation jobs, compared to White workers. It is more difficult to tele-work or take time off from these professions. People in lower-income communities also tend to live closer together, increasing the potential for spread…

How, if at all, will society change as a result of what we’re living though right now? One would like to think that there will be a reckoning of some kind, not just at the federal level, but here at the local level as well. Having lived in these United States for over half a century now, I’m not hopeful, but I’d like to think that, at the very least, we might be able to have an open and frank discussion about health disparities resulting from environmental racism, the implied privilege of “socially distancing,” and the way that we communicate about public health within our communities, among other things… And, of course, the debate over universal health care should now be officially over, right?

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187 Comments

  1. Demetrius
    Posted April 5, 2020 at 11:23 am | Permalink

    If nothing else, this virus is highlighting just how much the health of individuals, groups, and communities are inextricably linked.

    Making sure that everyone has access to quality healthcare (and paid sick time, etc.) isn’t just the “right” thing to do, it is also the smart thing to do – since making sure others are protected in these ways helps us to protect ourselves, as well.

    Universal health care is literally a “win-win” for individuals AND society.

  2. Lynne
    Posted April 5, 2020 at 4:14 pm | Permalink

    You are talking to people who think Trump is doing a good job handling things with this virus. They are just simply not going to see universal coverage as a desirable thing *especially* if it affects black people more than it affects white people.

  3. Jean Henry
    Posted April 5, 2020 at 4:33 pm | Permalink

    “Whatever it is, coronavirus has made the mighty kneel and brought the world to a halt like nothing else could. Our minds are still racing back and forth, longing for a return to “normality”, trying to stitch our future to our past and refusing to acknowledge the rupture. But the rupture exists. And in the midst of this terrible despair, it offers us a chance to rethink the doomsday machine we have built for ourselves. Nothing could be worse than a return to normality.

    Historically, pandemics have forced humans to break with the past and imagine their world anew. This one is no different. It is a portal, a gateway between one world and the next.

    We can choose to walk through it, dragging the carcasses of our prejudice and hatred, our avarice, our data banks and dead ideas, our dead rivers and smoky skies behind us. Or we can walk through lightly, with little luggage, ready to imagine another world. And ready to fight for it.”

    –Arundhati Roy

    https://www.ft.com/content/10d8f5e8-74eb-11ea-95fe-fcd274e920ca?fbclid=IwAR3LogPt9bozOz0zSdguC1DGRyY3ZsEqm_LsSe-Wt_yA1lLXIlJ1Z4Nki1Y

  4. Meta
    Posted April 5, 2020 at 8:47 pm | Permalink

    Michigan Radio: “Black people are 40% of COVID-19 deaths in MI. What does that mean?”

    Jon Zelner, a social epidemiologist at the University of Michigan, says the numbers don’t say everything, but there is something that can’t be ignored – inequality.

    “No one should be surprised that the classic social inequalities that characterize life in the United States, certainly life in Michigan, would be showing up right now,” Zelner said.

    Social inequalities like access to healthcare, access to jobs that are able to be done remotely, and underlying health issues such as diabetes and hypertension are all possible factors that Zelner believes may be contributing to the disparate outcomes.

    Read more:
    https://www.michiganradio.org/post/black-people-are-40-covid-19-deaths-mi-what-does-mean

  5. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 6:47 am | Permalink

    Aloha, winning hearts and minds, well maybe not
    https://www.caribbeannationalweekly.com/caribbean-breaking-news-featured/ventilators-destined-for-barbados-seized-by-united-states/

  6. Jean Henry
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 8:10 am | Permalink

    A bright side: https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-news-moguls-rupert-and-lachlan-murdoch-stockpile-attorneys-against-coronavirus-lawsuits

  7. Anonymous
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    The COVID-19 hospital pop-ups around the country are not for incoming patients that are too sick to stay home but not ill enough to be admitted to the ICU. They are step down units for patients that have survived the disease in the acute stage in the hospital, but are unable to be discharged out of the hospital care environment for a variety of reasons. Some might not be able to self isolate the remainder of the course of their disease because they live in a multigenerational home with other at risk individuals. Some might be sharing a house with multiple roommates and only one bathroom. Some might come from a group home situation where the home will not or cannot take them back. Some might need just a touch of supplemental oxygen, but are unable to get that in a home environment now because of lack of supply. Think of an assisted living scenario with largely ambulatory residents, all with COVID-19, but without outside visitors. How long is the stay? Until there is a safe place for them on the outside. It will be different time frames for different living situations. Without these convalescent wards, the acute care wards in the hospitals cannot be cleared out for new incoming patients.

  8. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 8:23 pm | Permalink

    https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2020/04/06/democrat-karen-whitsett-coronavirus-hydroxychloroquine-trump/2955430001/

  9. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    Can Sad link that Wylie coyote video again? I think there are some people on MM that might benefit from studying it.

  10. Sad
    Posted April 6, 2020 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    They’re easy to find.

    Everyone would benefit from that. Everyone thinks they’ve got it all figured out but something always goes wrong.

    Beep-beep

  11. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 5:56 am | Permalink

    https://youtu.be/Ee60vVR0fQQ

  12. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 7:23 am | Permalink

    Aloha, Sweden has discontinued using Trumps wonder drug https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22791382

  13. Sad
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    Sweden is really fucked up. Beautiful people. But fucked up.

    They will be the last country in the world to shut down.

  14. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 8:47 am | Permalink

    Aloha, more scientist demonstrating the wonder drug is ineffective on the virus
    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0399077X20300858?fbclid=IwAR0kl6Z52nvo0elsaLaG9PRaouCgXKGQYYOou3m42jJTGh2SBjDD2Yx19ZA

    Sweden was like Britain and the US, they are going for the illusive “herd imminity”. Once Johnson and Trump finally listened to the death projections, maybe natural herd immunity not such a good idea. Sweden currently has a mortality rate of nearly 8%.

  15. Gene Henry-Babble
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 10:48 am | Permalink

    Black people are ok but it’s more important to protect the feminist watchdogs at all costs. They are the eyes and ears and mouths of the Nation. Out there in the trenches (or on their iPad at home) keeping an eye of perceived slights to females. The ones that go unsaid between the lines of posts written by oppressive white-male pigs.

  16. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 10:59 am | Permalink

    I don’t think quoting an 8% death rate is meaningful when you are talking about a population that has chosento not test much, Wobblie.

  17. Cassandra
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 11:36 am | Permalink

    Welcome Gene. You clearly are going to fit right in around here.

  18. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 12:40 pm | Permalink

    Aloha FF, 7.8 % of those Swedes diagnosed with COVID-19 died, despite utilizing chloroquine.

  19. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 1:02 pm | Permalink

    I have no opinion about chloroquine.

    My understanding is Sweden chose to not test much. Maybe I am wrong? Assuming that is true, quoting their death rate might not have much meaning as they may have only been testing those with severe symptoms. You seem to be putting forth the notion that a seemingly high mortality rate in Sweden ought to mean something. Maybe 9% of the confirmed infected population would have died without the chloroquine? Do you know anything specific about the population tested? Am I wrong that they have chosen to not test much compared to other countries?

  20. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 3:24 pm | Permalink

    Aloha my Swedish friend reports that he is recovering after 3 weeks. Sounds like here, they only test those with symptoms.

  21. Jean Henry
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 5:53 pm | Permalink

    Noted that only Lynne and I , the raging feminists, are the only ones here other than Mark who are not anonymous. I’m wondering why the anti-feminist tirades always express themselves under cover of pseudonyms…

    Ps that old canard of trying to put white feminists against anti-racists is working pretty well for whites men but it’s tiresome. Lynne and I catch just as much shit for anti-racism posts as we do for calling out misogyny.

    The thing is we know these bigoted phenomena are totally normal. The defense against systemic bias is always that it’s normal. Until it’s not. My kids get gender bias and see it in all the movies and shows I grew up with. It doesn’t oppress them to see it. It’s just there and well, ridiculous. And embarrassing. They look forward to a time when gender is a private matter and otherwise is inconsequential.

    Someday you guys will see yourselves in another light or you’ll just die off.

  22. Jean Henry
    Posted April 7, 2020 at 8:38 pm | Permalink

    https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-coronavirus-and-inequality-meet-in-detroit

  23. Posted April 7, 2020 at 8:45 pm | Permalink

  24. Posted April 7, 2020 at 8:48 pm | Permalink

    Thanks, Jean that’s a great article. And it was good to see that they talked with El-Sayed.


    …The intensifying outbreak in Detroit has a significance beyond its population numbers; it suggests what may be the pandemic’s second American phase. Abdul El-Sayed, a former public-health professor and Detroit health director—who ran a losing, progressive campaign for the Michigan governorship in 2018—pointed out that the first phase of the pandemic docked in coastal cities whose populations are comparatively young and healthy: Seattle, the Bay Area, New York, Boston. “You’re talking about a virus that spread from abroad, and so it’s going to be people who are more likely to have been abroad,” El-Sayed said. “But, once it seeds, it is going to be those people with the higher levels of underlying disease, who are most disconnected from institutions, who are most vulnerable.” El-Sayed noted that Detroit has the highest rate of infant mortality of any large city in the country. “Obviously, a coronavirus infection and a death before the age of one are two very different outcomes,” he said. “But, when you work upstream, the things that predict one event predict the other as well.”…

  25. Anonymous
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 6:48 am | Permalink

    To be clear, the COVID-19 hotspots in New York City do not include Staten Island, Manhattan, or Brooklyn. They are centered in poor areas in Queens and the Bronx, although because of the dense nature of the city, there is spillage across micro neighborhoods. The virus was brought to metro Detroit (really metro anywhere) by people who travel and set up shop in the local community with the most risk factors for continued spread and symptomatic infection.

  26. Jean Henry
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 9:34 am | Permalink

    I wish El-Sayed had been successful in his run. I think if he had maybe he would have prevented the use of the airport for flights from Wuhan or delayed the primary because he understands the science. Maybe we’d be better prepared with PPE. Not that any of those thing would have prevented an outbreak or hot spots in underserved communities but they all would have helped some. He probably would have asked for M4A instead of opening up Obamacare— neither of which we got— except defacto through mass unemployment.

    Woulda, coulda, shoulda.

    Whitmer should have offered him a job running this thing.

  27. Jean Henry
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 10:55 am | Permalink

    A couple of years ago my daughter while living in Bushwick came down with appendicitis. She had Mi based health coverage and so took an Uber (smart girl) to the closest hospital that accepted our insurance. It is in Crown Heights and was what people call a ‘Medicaid Hospital.’ They took amazing care of her but she had old school slice and removed surgery and the physical conditions of the hospital were awful. Only one elevator worked. The place was falling apart. The nurses‘ attention to sanitation was remarkable and necessary. I never got a bill. I think they were thrilled to get the insurance payment. We were the only white people in the place that I saw. The disparity of health care access became even more apparent. My only hospital experiences had been at teaching hospitals with pretty amazing facilities comparatively Though I’ve heard many stories of ongoing bias against POC and the Medicaid recipients in those hospitals. So looks ain’t everything. the exception was Montefiore in the Bronx which was both a teaching hospital and whose patient base draws mostly from vulnerable communities. That place was Packed with patients spilling out into the hallways. The quality of care was amazing. I had been in a car accident and they examined and x-rayed me and had me back out on the streets in a few hours. The exit was literally an ambulance entrance. No greeters. I was told to call an Uber, and I did. I’m sure they are overwhelmed right now. If I had a bunch of money to give, I’d throw it their way.

    People of color are disproportionately negatively impacted by every crisis we have. Locally many have not recovered from the 2008 recession and are still losing housing as a result. I’m not sure when we will do what we need to do to correct course but I know the promise of universal coverage is just one step. The problem is deep. Infant and maternal mortality disparities in Michigan are Unacceptable and deeply disturbing.

  28. Jean Henry
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 1:33 pm | Permalink

    It looks like deaths at home in NYC are up to 200 per day from a. Norm of 20 per day. These aren’t necessarily classified as Covid-19.
    https://twitter.com/justinwolfers/status/1247705834651635713?s=21

  29. iRobert
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    Incidents like these are also contributing to the higher numbers in the inner cities.

    https://www.iheart.com/content/2020-03-31-line-of-cops-called-to-break-up-girls-birthday-party-in-los-angeles-park/

    But many people don’t think it should be shown.

  30. iRobert
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 5:10 pm | Permalink

    Populations in the inner cities are obviously more dense, and people come in to more close contact with others more frequently. That’s a very significant factor.

  31. iRobert
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    As the virus spreads, it will make its way increasingly out into more suburban and rural areas. It’s obviously going to initially spread and more rapidly in densely populated urban areas. Don’t think it won’t make its way through rural areas eventually though. All cold and flu viruses do. That’s also when you’ll see the concern and seriousness become more widespread.

  32. iRobert
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 7:19 pm | Permalink

    I think folks out in the country are getting a false sense of security from seeing how concentrated the outbreaks are in the big cities right now. But this thing is going to be just as bad when it really hits small towns, and the logistics of proving support to those areas is a greater challenge.

  33. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 8:42 pm | Permalink

    Perhaps there are behaviors that contribute. I think it is racist to never ever think that a particular genetic type of person is responsible for what they do. Like you don’t think they have the self control so they need to be coddled or some shit?

    https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/police-issue-ticket-for-violating-stay-home-order-after-breaking-up-party-at-detroits-rouge-park

  34. Sad
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 8:53 pm | Permalink

    A particular genetic type of person? What’s that?

    Are you still eating stew HW?

  35. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 9:03 pm | Permalink

    You can’t say “race” or some idiot will be like “HW, race has no scientific basis blah blah blah…” In this case is it black people or African Americans, take your pick. I think it applies to all “racial” or genetic types.

  36. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 9:30 pm | Permalink

    What’s going on? It’s spreading way slower than your projections promised. Way fewer deaths to date for sure.

  37. Sad
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 9:36 pm | Permalink

    Social distancing. It works.

    Have you noticed big chunks of the world have stopped?

    I see why people get frustrated with you.

    I hope you appreciate Mrs. Warlord

  38. Sad
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 9:37 pm | Permalink

    Have you noticed it’s spreading like crazy to the employees in the hospitals?

  39. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 10:27 pm | Permalink

    Wrong again, Sad. Social distancing was factored into the projections.

  40. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 10:29 pm | Permalink

    So now do you see why you are a dumbass instead of “why people get frustrated with me?” Smug but dumbassed!

  41. Jean Henry
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

    “particular genetic type of person” — wow.

    HW we say ‘Black people’ all the time around here, but most of us avoid saying racist shit when using the term… You felt compelled to use that bizarre coded language (which BTW reeks of biological determinism) because you knew you were stepping in a pile of blame the victom dodoo.

  42. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 10:57 pm | Permalink

    It’s not a “code for black people”, dick. What I said goes for all the peoples. You are the fuckin’ racist for acting like black people are always victims.

  43. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 8, 2020 at 11:03 pm | Permalink

    East Oakland

    https://twitter.com/hrtablaze/status/1244664048475492352?s=20

  44. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:19 am | Permalink

    This outbreak isn’t performing up to your requirements. What are you going to do? You need the election outcome to be controlled somehow and it looks like virus hysteria is dying down. Some kind of CIA-manufactured app to replace actually voting? Let me hear your ideas.

  45. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:32 am | Permalink

    Re: your stupid point about genetic determinism: Read what I say. It’s a critique of YOUR HANDICAPPING of black people. It’s always because of their victim status. You won’t admit there have been large groups of them partying their ass off together in the streets during this shit. Let’s be real.

  46. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 7:12 am | Permalink

    Aloha it has been obvious for years that HW is disassociated from reality. Now he seems to be saving there aint enough dead for this to be serious. Besides it genetic who gets it.
    Im still waiting for the DOJ to start sweeping up those with those secret indictments.

  47. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 7:12 am | Permalink

    I’ve seen large groups of shite people partying their asses off to HW. The outcome disparity according to every public health organization I’ve seen reporting the numbers is a result of inequity of access to care. Pre-existing conditions like diabetes, high blood pressure, asthma and heart disease increase the risk for mortality for Covid patients. Management of these diseases requires expensive prescriptions and ongoing care many in vulnerable populations can’t access.

    How do you explain the high levels of maternal and infant mortality (almost double that of whites) in Black population in MI? Too much partying?

  48. Sad
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 7:13 am | Permalink

    Don’t worry HW Whitmer is going to announce her extension of the stay at home order this afternoon at 3. There will be additional measures to tighten up the system and reduce the spread of the virus. She will be canceling the August elections and she will accept the position as Joe abide she VP.

    Take that you foul mouthed name caller.

  49. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 7:20 am | Permalink

    I get your point re white liberals ‘handicapping’ Black people with pity and lower standards. I’ve seen it expressed as another form of condescension. As pity in lieu of action. I just don’t see hie it applies here.

    I don’t see black people being dumber than white people out there in terms of their health and safety.

    The personal responsibility argument around a pandemic or any illness is far too easy to jump to as an excuse for not caring adequately for those in need. Everyone should have equal access to health care— Don’t you agree?

    Should we stop treating motorcycle riders who don’t wear helmets and/or protective gear?

  50. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    “Now he seems to be saving there aint enough dead for this to be serious. Besides it genetic who gets it.”

    You are a total moron.

  51. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    “I’ve seen large groups of shite people partying their asses off to HW.”

    First of all: nice freudian slip there. Second: show me. I have not seen what you have seen and I have no reason to trust your word.

  52. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 9:59 am | Permalink

    I saw about a dozen frat boys and sorority girls going through the motions on St. Patricks day but that has been about it.

  53. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 10:35 am | Permalink

    Most people, regardless of their particular social identity, understand that individuals, who are behaving without concern for others, should be criticized, without regard for the group which the irresponsible individual happens to be affiliated with.

  54. Hyperian Warlock
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 11:24 am | Permalink

    Chicanos are partying their asses off even more than blacks to celebrate the pandemic, but liberals won’t acknowledge that because they are the real racists. I don’t see color.

  55. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 11:38 am | Permalink

    There were many many viral images of white kids partying in Florida and NEw Orleans over Spring Break and hipsters in Brooklyn handing out in bars. I see white teens hanging out in the woods land by the river ocally daily. Especially on the first few warm days. They are for sure not related. It has slowed down. Please remember when you lok at internet images they can be from any time. You need to vet.

    I have heard that many young people of color heard they were low risk due to some early misinformation coming out of Africa and Italy/China. It’s not super easy to reach those communities. They aren’t watching the 6 o’clock news.

    Reaching them has become a public health priority so no one is ignoring that piece.
    But the deaths for black people at up to 6x the rates of Caucasians (Chicago) is out of scale even to the rates of contraction among Black citizens. Are you going to blame mortality on their partying too?

    And then there is the fact than many POC can’t afford not to work. There are people on street corners with signs saying will work for food. There are many many factors contributing to POC being more vulnerable to the impacts of this crisis, just as they are more vulnerable and slower to recover from every crisis.

    Personal responsibility can not explain the scope and prevalence of these disparities.

  56. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 11:40 am | Permalink

    You can go check out the docks at Bandemeer park on any warm day or the running trails in Ann Arbor if you want to see real time images of white people being stupid.

  57. Anonymous
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:17 pm | Permalink

    Best HW quote ever. Please put this on the front page.

    “Chicanos are partying their asses off even more than blacks to celebrate the pandemic, but liberals won’t acknowledge that because they are the real racists. I don’t see color.”

  58. Sad
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

    Man I haven’t been invited to any pandemic celebration parties.

  59. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:46 pm | Permalink

    Anonymous, imo, seems to get everything a little bit wrong 100% of the time. Odd.

  60. Sad
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:58 pm | Permalink

    Well if there’s anyone who knows wrong it’s you FF.

  61. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 12:59 pm | Permalink

    I never said a lot of people of all colors aren’t stupid. I didn’t say anyone was stupid at all. I only put up some links with current stories and videos. Do the stupid white people you see at the park have those kind of parties? For real? Do you think reality is racist therefore it is racist to be in reality?

  62. Lynne
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 1:16 pm | Permalink

    I went out the other day to go to the grocery store and it was such a lovely day that I decided to go for a drive. There was actually a lot of traffic which I found interested and people were out and about. So the behavior here isn’t all that great either and yet, California has many fewer cases than other places even though the virus was detected here first. There is more than just behavior at play for sure.

    Stanford is doing a study to see if the virus got to California much earlier and possibly now there is a herd immunity.

  63. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 1:17 pm | Permalink

    Try be specific so we can talk about how I might be wrong when it comes up, Sad. Your vague-cutie-cute-cutesy-routine may have served you in the past but it has its limitations.

  64. Posted April 9, 2020 at 1:27 pm | Permalink

    FF, what limitations? When Sad says that you know wrong, I know EXACTLY what he means. Just because you aren’t able to see it, it doesn’t mean no one else can. Is that specific enough for you?

  65. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    I asked specific questions of HW about mortality v infection rate disparity among black people and he ignored it in order to bluster some more about his anecdotal evidence from the interwebs.

  66. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 2:13 pm | Permalink

    HW– And yes, I do think that reality is racist. But not because there is any meaningful difference between the races other than how they are treated and the opportunities they are offered. The reality we all live in within this country is racist. We are steeped in it. And our systems are built on it and are committed to maintaining it.

    And yes, it makes no sense, is counter-productive and really really economically draining. That’s how I know it’s based in bias (which is a conditioned emotional response) not reason of any kind.

  67. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

    If you are that focused on reality being racist perhaps sometimes you mistake behavioral trends for racism. There is terrible access to basic food ingredients in stores in large parts of Detroit. There are all kinds of things like that for sure and that should all be changed. There are also realities like a lot of black people thought it was a good idea to drive out white people from Detroit in the 60’s. There are those big ass parties now, which I am not overly worried about. Just saying they have been happening and that ought to be acknowledged in an honest blog post.

  68. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

    Princess Cassandra,

    What have I said that is wrong in this thread and why?

    Anonymous, is a little bit wrong there because he seemed to not read the name correctly. Which I find hilarious because he thought it would be great to lift the non-quote of an imposter up to illustrate a typical pattern demonstrated by HW. In reality the typical pattern is that, at a very high rate, Cassandra, JH, Anon, and Sad misrepresent the views of others.

  69. Sad
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 3:20 pm | Permalink

    I don’t represent the views of others.

    I’m only here to judge.

  70. Posted April 9, 2020 at 3:23 pm | Permalink

    HW, WTF? You think the white flight in Detroit was because black people decided to drive out the white people??? That is not even close to reality. I say this as a white person who lived in Detroit from the last part of the 60s until the 80s. White people moved to the ‘burbs because they were racists directly or were responding to systemic racism such as falling home values and decreased access to education among other things.

    FF, one thing that you have said that is wrong is that you seem to think that people’s impressions of you should be limited to this thread. I don’t know if what you have said otherwise (other than your comment to Sad which I have already commented on) is correct or not because I don’t always read what you post as I generally find it of little value.

  71. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 3:53 pm | Permalink

    Cassandra,

    Will you at some point explain to Jean why I refer to you as Cassandra? I feel cruel telling her myself.

  72. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    “you seem to think that people’s impressions of you should be limited to this thread.”

    LOL. Cassandra is super desperate to feel right about something apparently. Unfortunately for Cassandra, I don’t think I am requesting anyone to limit their impressions based on super small sample sizes. That would be dumb. I was asking Sad to be specific. I was trying to narrow it down.

    It is always this vague put forth notion, with you guys, that other people are wrong, but you never seem to able to point to specific things. It always seems to be your present judgments are formed by all of these mysterious judgments, so far in the past that we can’t take a look at them to examine the instances. Seems convenient to me.

    An empty present can’t always be the alibi for your wacky judgments can it?

  73. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 4:36 pm | Permalink

    Gaos in healthcare services down South are making the dispraity of outcomes along race lines even worse:
    https://www.essence.com/feature/black-southern-rural-covid-19-coronavirus/

    Or it could be the partying…/s

  74. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 4:38 pm | Permalink

    The idea that Black people drove out White people in Detroit is really just fucking amazing. That’s pretty outrageous even for you, HW.

  75. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 4:43 pm | Permalink

    FF I remember that Lynne said she felt like Cassandra here sometimes. What I don’t understand i why you find that funny or continue to refer to her that way.

    Her analysis seemed apt. I can see why she feels like she’s shouting into the void here. This blog comment section feels super regressive a lot of the time and not just because of the conservatives here. It’s just weird to have supposed progressives not understanding what it means to say we live in a White Supremacist country still. Even if it’s a reach, they should be able to grasp the concept and the utility of broadening the idea of white supremacy beyond some marginal political extremist bad guys,

  76. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    I’m sure white flight had nothing to do with blacks burning the city down and things like that.

  77. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 5:41 pm | Permalink

    It’s bizarre to me you think blacks can only be victims and not do anything wrong. I think a lot of black people would be annoyed as shit too if they thought about what you are saying. There was a lot of anti-white sentiment going around and that is the reality. I never said there was no anti-black racism either. It’s called reality, you fools.

  78. Jean Henry
    Posted April 9, 2020 at 11:17 pm | Permalink

    “A riot is the language of the unheard.”– MLK Jr.

    (That’s for iRobert.)

    I mean white people riot over football championships, so whatever I guess.

    HW what do you think was the cause of the Detroit uprising?

    Can you imagine an uprising if Trump were removed from office? Many of your ilk have threatened the same. Would that be more justified? What kind of societal experience would warrant a revolt?

  79. stupid hick
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 12:47 am | Permalink

    “Anonymous, is a little bit wrong there because he seemed to not read the name correctly. Which I find hilarious because he thought it would be great to lift the non-quote of an imposter up to illustrate a typical pattern demonstrated by HW. In reality the typical pattern is that, at a very high rate, Cassandra, JH, Anon, and Sad misrepresent the views of others.”

    Does anyone know for a fact that Hyperian Warlock and Hyborian Warlord are not the same person? They sound exactly the same to me. Does anyone understand what FF’s point is? Is it that one is a fake racist, and the other is not, or something like that?

  80. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 2:43 am | Permalink

    SH, you can do it: Out of the thousands of comments HW has posted Anonymous appears to have thought the one comment that typified HW the most was a comment HW did not make.

    It’s not that you are stupid SH, you just so badly need to find outlets for your hate, that you end up saying stupid things.

  81. Sad
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 6:47 am | Permalink

    FF it’s that no one really pays attention to what you write.

    You still don’t get it?

  82. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 9:13 am | Permalink

    I couldn’t care less, Sad. Ignore me as you please.

  83. Sad
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 9:29 am | Permalink

    Did you say something?

    Did you get your garden in before the evil mean Governor put her foot down?

  84. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 9:46 am | Permalink

    FF– Anonymous said it was the “best HW quote ever.” That could point to Hyborin Warlord *or* Hyperian Warlock.

    I’m afraid it was you who made the assumption.

    “[You are] a little bit wrong there because [you] seemed to not read the name [Anon cited] correctly. Which I find hilarious because [you] thought it would be great to lift the [an Anon citation] up to illustrate a typical pattern demonstrated by [others]. In reality, the typical pattern is that, at a very high rate, [you]misrepresent the views of others.

  85. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 10:08 am | Permalink

    Of course it is possible Anonymous was aware that it was Hyperion Warlock not HW. Which is why I said “seemed” and “appeared”… Anonymous can also set it straight if he wants . No big deal. Either way I find Anonymous consistently odd in general. How many times has Hyperion Warlock posted? 30 times? Yeah let’s put that silly mockery on the front page because it is so awesome?

    You seem so desperate to appear right about something, Jean. Good luck with that.

  86. Posted April 10, 2020 at 10:24 am | Permalink

    JH appears right way more than FF does, fwiw

  87. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 10:28 am | Permalink

    I don’t believe you Cassandra.

  88. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 10:31 am | Permalink

    Lynne,

    Do you remember the time you said you sometimes feel like Cassandra on this forum? Just curious :)

  89. Posted April 10, 2020 at 11:46 am | Permalink

    FF, I seldom remember anything I say but as I do often feel that way and am enough of a Trojan fan that I’ve read the Aeneid in the original Latin, it seems likely that I said it. I am not going to do a search or anything to prove it.

  90. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 12:03 pm | Permalink

    It’s ok. Jean re-members.

  91. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 12:27 pm | Permalink

    I could always be wrong, FF. Memory is fallible for everyone. It’s not an indictment to misremember something. https://www.healthline.com/health-news/mental-memory-is-unreliable-and-it-could-be-worse-091313#1

    You’d have to be delusional to believe your memory is accurate. As a general observation, believing one’s own memory is accurate or more accurate than others’ seems to be part of OWDDS–Old White Dude Derangement Syndrome. I personally welcome being wrong. But I also enjoy correcting blowhards. It’s not a compulsion, just a hobby.

  92. Posted April 10, 2020 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

    “OWDDS–Old White Dude Derangement Syndrome”

    HAHAHAHAHAHA. That is hilarious!

  93. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 4:55 pm | Permalink

    I just don’t believe Cassandra is really laughing even when she says she is laughing.

  94. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 5:13 pm | Permalink

    Look FF I know you think you are being clever with the Cassandra references. You seem to think you are getting away with something. Or provoking us with your riddles because you think you are clever. But you just look strange and defensive. It’s an obvious push to pivot the conversation whenever you get caught with your pants down… again.

    The odd thing is all you are doing by referring to Cassandra is reminding us over and over of that other time you got caught with your pants down.

    Just pull up your big boy pants and move on.

  95. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 5:34 pm | Permalink

    Aloha, OWDDS—it is a wonderful thing how racial and generational stereotyping is such a liberal thing to do.

  96. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 5:59 pm | Permalink

    It’s amazing how so many liberal white dudes think reverse racism is a thing.

    Man, they get real worked up about it when someone cracks a joke about them… Why are they so fragile? Did someone steal their lolli?

    So Wobblie, when you were a young hippie what did you think of old people? of ‘straights?’
    Did you trust people over 30?

    Was any of your criticism, if you had any, of the older generations–esp “the greatest generation”–on target? Deserved. Or was it just straight up stereotyping without warrant– bigotry?
    Did you make fun of those people? Crack a few jokes at their expense?

    Do you make fun of Lynne and I?

    Can’t you take a fucking joke?
    I mean how rough have old white dudes had it?
    Why so whiney?
    Pull up your big boy pants.

  97. Sad
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 7:21 pm | Permalink

    Thank you President Trump.

    Looking at the formula for unemployment I will be making more not working than I was working. Such acgenerous act for a Republican. I can’t wait to hear what he’ll be putting forward this fall in proposals going forward.

    Now I just have to put in my application on ?Monday. I Hope our wonderful Governor has the system up and running properly. I think a lot of us will be making use of it.

    Now if we could just get her to drag out this stay at home order a few more months.

  98. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 7:56 pm | Permalink

    When did I have my pants down? Can you explain it to me? Maybe Cassandra can chime in and explain what you are talking about?

  99. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 7:58 pm | Permalink

    It’s almost like Jean wants me to stop calling Lynne “Cassandra”. Is that what you want Jean?

  100. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 8:00 pm | Permalink

    SAD and anyone applying for unemployment. If you apply and get rejected because you are outside the normal parameters of who receives UI benefits, then you will need to fill out a form to protest the decision within 30 days of rejection notice, statting that you qualify under the new expanded UI qualifications. You can also just re-apply but right now the system still does not seem to be updated. I think the decision protest will work. But I’m telling everyone to do it all. And you will wait on the phone or refreshing your browser for days. But you are unemployed so you have time to do that!

    I am also advising most people to expect 2-3 weeks for a decision and longer for the direct deposits to come through. (although the check time lag seems highly variable. Do not sign up for a card. That takes 3 weeks longer.

    Calling or trying to sign in at weird hours works for many.

  101. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 9:01 pm | Permalink

    Aloha JH, I was not criticizing or attempting to impose PC thought. I think that is the Democratic Party’s job.
    I still think most people over 30 are pretty fucked up. And no one has said anything about old men drivers in hats. I mean ourlesser evil choice is an old white demented groper instead of an old white demented racist groper.
    Im surprised by the people I see expressing a rejection of a return to the pre-virus normality.

  102. Jean Henry
    Posted April 10, 2020 at 10:01 pm | Permalink

    Wobblie– I think very few people want to maintain the status quo– certainly not on the left. They all want dramatic social change. And they generally want change that bends towards justice in one form or another. But they also value certain rights and privileges they enjoy already and they are protective of those and in those areas they resist change. In those areas they sound the alarm and articulate the cost of change. We don’t all agree on the form of change we prioritize and certainly not the path., but I honestly don’t think you are in any way more progressive than say, Mark or Lynne. You believe you are because of ideology and that’s fine. But it’s just another belief system. You have some super engrained old curmudgeonly ways too. The point of the democratic plurality os to balance out interests. It’s a beautiful thing when piles of corporate cash and foreign interference don’t enter the democracy mix. I feel we are much more threatened by the erosion of democracy than we are by conservatives.

    Trump is different. He’s uniquely horrid. It’s a bullshit false equivalency to put he and Biden on the same level. Yes, they are both sexist boobs. We’ve had so many sexist presidents. They all were really except maybe Carter. Trump’s racism is horrific particularly as enacted as policy but he couldn’t have enacted so many horrendous racist policies if the systems of oppression weren’t already in place for him to amp up, The biggest threat TRump presents is that he is authoritarian. He is eroding our capacity to create change and progress as a nation. Raxism has been around forever and so has sexism. We can take another four years of both. But we can’t survive if our ability to create change is inexorably blocked.

    We’ve had a lot of shitty leaders but the political pendulum always swings and somehow we have also always made bits of progress after decades of hard work. Incrementalism isn;t my preference but Democracy is. And incrementalism is simply a democratic reality unless someone is being super out of bounds– like Trump is being.

    I don’t want what you want Wobblie. Not because I don’t want change but because I don’t want our democracy to erode further. Your belief system demands compliance. That inclination is anti-democratic.Your my or highway schtick is for emergencies and pandemics (and look how shitty we are at it even at the risk of death). I want economic equity and social justice. I just don’t want it your way. You aren’t more progressive than the liberals here. You are just a different kind of fucked up.

    I’m a firm believer in free speech including the right to say shit that makes people uncomfortable. Saying things is not suppression. You seem to think it is. I’m not interested in brittleness of spirit. I’m bored by anyone who can’t take a joke at their own expense or a few cheap shots. No group or faction has a monopoly on that kind of prickliness, but old white dudes look the most ridiculous complaining about how they are treated. Trump whines about it every day. But I’ll be damned if A2 politicos don’t also whine about people who criticize them being mean to them. They too are command control and find participatory democracy inconvenient when it disagrees with them.

    You are wrong if you think people who are not in your political camp have not also wanted social and economic justice or improved lives for all humans, not just Americans, for a very long time. Our disagreement is more on how than what.

    Pandemics and other disasters have historically created an impetus for great social change and cultural blossoming after the fact. And change requires impetus. You seem to think yelling from your armchair should be enough impetus. Your resentment towards those who would be your allies because it’s not enough, just makes you seem pathetic. In a democracy, nobody gets their way.

  103. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 12:16 am | Permalink

    How are we doing on words, Sad?

  104. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 6:03 am | Permalink

    I don’t know if you noticed but with our governors stay at home order to relaxed the limit on word usage. With many non essential people having so much extra time we are providing more leeway.

    Have you been reprimanded for your use of words since March 23? Can you provide an exact coatation for the instance you were rebuked? If so I will provide a written apology.

    That being said. Even with our new relaxed policy, that is a lot of words.

  105. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 6:19 am | Permalink

    Aloha JH, you arevery confused. You make up lots of things about my believes. We have had disagreements on many things— You are pro-nuclear power, you are pro-fracking, you are pro-US wars. I suspect you are also gungho for most privatization scheme and corporate bailouts. You are in favor of lesser evil voting and voter shaming. You are an ageist racist. You exemplify the white upper middle class. I am none of these things.
    So no I am not your kinda “progressive”.

  106. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 8:39 am | Permalink

    I’m surprised, and a little disappointed, that nobody makes fun of how lazy I am in writing my posts here. I used to take things seriously enough to use proper grammar. I used to read through my comments before I posted them. I deserve to be made fun of about that. Even Sad makes more effort than I do these days.

  107. Jean Henry
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:01 am | Permalink

    Wobblie– I am pro-climate action; pro getting to net-zero emissions — even if that involves nuclear power and natural gas as a transitional fuel. I’m pro green new deal. I am pro-diplomatic solutions and harm reduction in foreign policy v only protecting US interests. I have protesting every war and invasion we have engaged in. I do think we should stay in places so long as they want us and clean up the messes we make. I would like the military to evolve into a diplomatic corps. I’m pro-small business bailouts and worker protections and expanded social safety net. I’m very pro-banking regulation. I’m pro breaking up the big banks and facebook, amazon, google. I’m not for statism or for the idea that the government is good at running businesses like parking structures etc, but I’m all for labor requirements and minimum wages and other restrictions on government contracts and more. I’m pro-housing development both private, hybrid and subsidized. I’m pro-growing the shit out of our cities and pro alternative transportation and complete streets that weight pedestrian and cycling infrastructure at least equal to automobile infrastructure. I’m for the “war on cars” — they need to go away as quickly as possible. I’m for free and universal and equitable health care, but I suspect the ‘free’ part will take a while. I believe housing and health care are human rights. I’m for prison abolition and a replacement with a victim-centered restorative justice and rehabilitative programs. I’m for reparations and UBI. I’m for retiring all student debt. I’d be happy if there were no private k-12 schools but I know that’s even less likely than the others so I’ll just say we have to fix the education and suspension gap in public schools and fund them adequately and equally. And I’m pro-retiring all existing student debt and restructuring the post k-12 educational system so it offers more financial opportunity and less financial burden.I’m pro ERA and bodily autonomy for all humans. And yes I’m pro-voting and pro-democracy. And you know what? I don’t believe it’s possible to vote without voting for a lesser evil. No one is perfect, Wobblie.

    PS you voter shamed me and then, in the same sentence, said I was pro voter shaming..

    I’m for things Wobblie. Not just against them. You seem to have confused being self-righteous and judgmental with being righteous and an advocate. It’s not about you and your beliefs, Wobblie. It’s about creating change. But you know keep digging into those 9-11 truther conspiracy theories. That’s some strong political armchair advocacy work you’re doing there.

  108. stupid hick
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:17 am | Permalink

    “Out of the thousands of racist comments HW has posted Anonymous appears to have thought the one comment that typified HW the most was a comment HW did not make.”

    So the point is, Warlord makes racist comments 1000 times more often than Warlock so it’s not fair for Warlock to come out of nowhere and make one substantially similar comment, and steal all the credit for Warlord’s past work? That would be a pretty demented point to make, even for a Trump cultist.

  109. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:39 am | Permalink

    Racist according to you who are a dumbass.

  110. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:42 am | Permalink

    You can’t come up with one legitimate racist thing I’ve said because I am not racist. Baynardites do try to stoke racial hatred though as I have shown. You want to train black people to blame whitey for everything and never take responsibility.

  111. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 11:04 am | Permalink

    SH,

    You are just adding a layer to the weirdness when you intentionally misquoted me. HW does not say racist things. Warlock misrepresented HW as racist through a satirical comment. Anonymous misapprehended the satirical misrepresentation. Now you, Stupid Hick, are intentionally misquoting the person who pointed out the misapprehension of the misrepresentation.

    Bottom line: If you think HW says a lot of racist things point them out. You will be forced to defend your accusation though and I really don’t think that will work out too well for you. You already know that though, don’t you?

  112. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    Deaths south of 20,000 today. You think we will break the big milestone? It’s all Donald Twump’s fault even if we are kicking the shit out of the projections’ ass.

  113. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 1:20 pm | Permalink

    HW the projection are low because Dr. Fauci is a fucking bad ass who has somehow managed to step into a position of authority, even with Trump, and get done what needed to get done.

    Fauci is the Boss!

  114. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

    Oh so it’s Dr. Fauci who made the hard, consequential decisions to block travel and fast-track medicine and so on. I see.

  115. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 2:45 pm | Permalink

    If you took off the Trump blinders you might see.

    When did Trump block travel from Europe?

  116. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 3:28 pm | Permalink

    Looks like it was 3-12. So what? You think Fauci made him do it or some shit?

  117. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 3:31 pm | Permalink

    Interesting 2017 comment by the doctor

    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fauci-warned-of-trump-pandemic-2017_n_5e8a0548c5b6e7d76c65c8a4

  118. stupid hick
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 3:41 pm | Permalink

    I’m sorry I still don’t understand, which of these HW quotes is a real racist comment and which one is satire?

    Warlord: “It’s always because of their victim status. You won’t admit there have been large groups of negroes partying their ass off together in the streets during this shit. Let’s be real.”

    Warlock: “Chicanos are partying their asses off even more than blacks to celebrate the pandemic, but liberals won’t acknowledge that because they are the real racists. I don’t see color.”

  119. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

    For starters you intentionally misquoted again.

  120. stupid hick
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 4:29 pm | Permalink

    Oops my mistake, all the HWs on this blog look alike to me. Here you go, now which is racist and which is a pathetic joke?

    Warlock: “It’s always because of their victim status. You won’t admit there have been large groups of negroes partying their ass off together in the streets during this shit. Let’s be real.”

    Warlord: “Chicanos are partying their asses off even more than blacks to celebrate the pandemic, but liberals won’t acknowledge that because they are the real racists. I don’t see color.”

  121. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 4:40 pm | Permalink

    Don’t you think it only hurts your campaign against me to have to lie about what I say? Or do you think it’s a winning strategy? I think it is vicious and stupid.

  122. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 4:44 pm | Permalink

    Thank you stupid

    When this is all over let me buy you a dinner.

  123. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 5:23 pm | Permalink

    SH is doing an Abbot and Costello type routine now? Sad who does like unnecessary words likes it a lot?

    SH has intentionally misquoted 3 times now. Intentional misquote if an intentionally taken out of context comment. For what?

    #loser

  124. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 6:14 pm | Permalink

    About 27 words FF, you used approximately twice as many to say nothing.

    The H’s word don’t count as Stupids.

  125. Jean Henry
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 6:51 pm | Permalink

    HW– That link IS interesting. Are you imagining this is evidence of some kind of intentional release of a deadly pathogen to hurt Trump? Because that’s what a lot of Trumpers think– That we’d kill the economy and thousands of people just to get rid of Trump. Dr Fauci is an epidemiologist. His job is to predict disease. So Dr Fauci predicting an outbreak is just what he does. And many other epidemiologists have been warning of the same risk.

    Here’s what you own source actually says:
    “Despite Fauci’s early warnings and calls for action, a report on Sunday analyzing the Trump administration’s response to the coronavirus pandemic found that federal agencies waited until the middle of last month to order vital medical supplies and equipment to fight the coronavirus, despite warnings about its pandemic potential being made in January. As the virus has spread across the country, reports persist of mass shortages of supplies in hospitals and medical centers. “We basically wasted two months,” Kathleen Sebelius, who served as the Health and Human Services secretary during the Obama administration, told The Associated Press of the government’s response.”

  126. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

    That part of the article is not related to the 2017 quote.

    Jean, haven’t you learned one thing throughout this massive losing streak you are on? If I don’t say I think it is evidence of some thing then don’t assume it. Obviously this certainly could be an intentional bio-warfare operation though. If you think that is ridiculous you are brain dead.

  127. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 8:50 pm | Permalink

    By the way: multiple Grand Juries subpoenaed according to Jon Solomon and you know he has been rock solid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKYYPh8rvQU

  128. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 8:53 pm | Permalink

    Fauci’s prediction was a safe bet. Every administration has dealt with a serious outbreak. They happen with regularity. This COVID-19 (SARS-COV2 virus) just happens to be a bit more contagious than most.

    It is clearly possibility that this virus was developed as a bio-weapon. That fact is not changed by any fool’s discomfort with the possibility, or because some fool saying otherwise makes them appear level-headed.

  129. Jean Henry
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 9:04 pm | Permalink

    “If I don’t say I think it is evidence of some thing then don’t assume it. “ didn’t assume it. I asked the question.

    “Obviously this certainly could be an intentional bio-warfare operation though” — so the answer is yes then?

    Bat shit crazy. But you aren’t alone.
    https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/04/08/nearly-three-in-ten-americans-believe-covid-19-was-made-in-a-lab/

  130. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 9:05 pm | Permalink

    It is clearly a possibility that this virus was developed as a bio-weapon. That fact is not changed by any fool’s discomfort with the possibility. Nor is it changed by some fool’s belief that saying otherwise makes them appear level-headed.

    If it was a deliberate deployment of a bio-weapon, the general public will almost certainly never know. It isn’t the sort of information that is ever shared publicly. But I am just stating the obvious.

  131. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

    Those nearly “three-in-ten Americans” would be correct to believe it is a possibility that the virus was created in a lab. They are wrong if they believe they can say with any certainty that it was.

    A person who believes they can say with certainty that is wasn’t created in a lab is just as wrong and just as crazy as those who believe they can be certain it was created in a lab.

  132. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 9:44 pm | Permalink

    Based in the infographic on the page Jean linked, men, whites, and college educated people are most arrogant in their unjustifiable assumptions. Black respondents gave the answer that makes sense, which is “not sure.”

    If you think you can say it is most likely the virus occurred naturally, or was created in a lab, you are wrong. You don’t have the information to come to either of those conclusions.

  133. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 9:59 pm | Permalink

    The survey question asks what is most LIKELY based upon the info the respondent has at hand. Responding “not sure” does not answer the question.

  134. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:17 pm | Permalink

    Respondents can’t determine what is most likely, FF. They do not have information sufficient to determine what is most likely.

    The only accurate response is “not sure.”

  135. Sad
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

    FF is incapable of understanding how someone could say “not sure”

    He does not have those

    Words

  136. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:21 pm | Permalink

    What we can learn from the infographic is that men, whites and college educated people are most likely to draw conclusions (on this particular topic) for which they have no logical basis. That shouldn’t surprise anybody either.

    If you think they do have information to base any conclusion besides “not sure,” please tell us what that information is.

  137. iRobert
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:38 pm | Permalink

    Also, I agree, if anyone here believes HW has said something racist, please explain what he said and how it’s racist. I am not certain he has.

    What I do think is certain is that making general accusations without specific evidence to support it is weak at the very least. It more likely suggests the general accusation being made is a false one.

  138. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 10:49 pm | Permalink

    No Sad. I am certain that I am not sure. The question does not ask for certainty it asks respondents what they think is “most likely” given the info they have. It does not make sense to me to answer “I am not sure“ what I think is most likely.

  139. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 11, 2020 at 11:04 pm | Permalink

    iRobert,

    I read the question as asking not for determining what is most likely. I read the question as asking what I believe. What sort of actions would I promote based upon my flimsy belief? Not much. Answer a survey question? Yes. Go to war? No.

  140. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 12:33 am | Permalink

    Jean doesn’t have the ability to distinguish between someone saying something is possible and saying they believe it. Is it possible to have a meaningful conversation with someone with so little understanding?

  141. Posted April 12, 2020 at 1:00 am | Permalink

    I think HW’s suggestion that the reason black people are dying at a greater rate is due to their behavior when there is no evidence of any great difference in behavior between black people and other groups is pretty racist. Especially considering the huge systemic problems faced by many black people that damage their health and thus make them more prone to having the underlying conditions that are often related to dying from this virus. It isn’t just black people either. It is native people. I suspect if we looked closely, we might find that poor white people are having issues as well.

    There is a lot we don’t know too. Why is California doing so well when compared to Michigan? I am pretty sure it isn’t related to behavior. California locked down a few days before Michigan but community spread of this virus was found here before there were any cases in Michigan. I am sure we will eventually find out and I suspect that we will find that things like access to health care, environmental racism, poverty, and other systemic things matter a lot.

  142. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 1:15 am | Permalink

    I didn’t suggest what you said, Lynne. Why do you baynardites always have to try to change what people say? I can’t imagine living like that. There do in fact seem to be more blatantly defiant public gatherings featuring predominantly black people than other groups from what I have seen. I don’t think it is racist to notice that. I think it is dumb as shit to call it racist.

    Nice message from Ghana. Trust me you aren’t winning brownie points with these folks.

    https://twitter.com/ColinSkow/status/1249018424111464451

  143. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 1:21 am | Permalink

    There is no point in talking shit. If you have some evidence to equal what I already posted then you ought to post it. If you don’t then don’t talk about me.

  144. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 9:41 am | Permalink

    “considering the huge systemic problems faced by many black people that damage their health and thus make them more prone to having the underlying conditions that are often related to dying from this virus. It isn’t just black people either. It is native people. I suspect if we looked closely, we might find that poor white people are having issues as well.”

    I will never stop thinking it is hilarious that Cassandra loves to assume other people do not consider these things factors. She loves to turn away from concrete particulars and turn toward the general, vague, and abstract. Cassandra thinks she is winning arguments by speaking these supposedly deep hidden truths, as if they are unknown to others, when in actuality the shit is so obvious.

  145. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:30 am | Permalink

    HW doesn’t have the ability to distinguish between someone ASKING A QUESTION and MAKING AN ASSERTION. Is it possible to have a meaningful conversation with someone with so little understanding?

  146. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:38 am | Permalink

    The people of Ghana and Africa overall have fallen for a whole lot of snake oil being sold by White Americans and Europeans. Those folks won;t be the first or the last. The young woman seems very good at reading a cue card though. Do you think they have been paid? Or were they actually converted to a US-focused, wrap-around amalgam of conspiracy theories? How global is the reach of Q believers?

    The amusing thing here is that you seem to assume that, for white Americans who are engaged in anti-racism, any Black person saying anything is somehow confered moral authority and legitimacy. Like they can’t be countered. Or wrong. Ever. Equity does not demand glorification. That’s a patriarchal notion and a trap.

  147. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:49 am | Permalink

    Yep. The creator of that tweet links to a profile of its supposed creator started in March 2020. That profile first tweeted 22 hours ago but by supporting Q now has 2200 followers. That profile also never tweeted the original video. The white dude did.
    He created a black twitter sock puppet to legitimize his bullshit.

    Yeah, you Q folks are super discerning of your sources.

  148. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:51 am | Permalink

    Forgot link. Here. Check her out. Will be interesting to watch her followers grow. https://twitter.com/OptZazy

  149. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:53 am | Permalink

    Re-read Jean. Compare what other people actually say with what you claim they say.

  150. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 11:32 am | Permalink

    You insinuated that I answered yes to your question regarding belief that covid 19 is biowarfare. You have failed in life in basic comprehension. I am wise enough to see how much I do not know therefore I consider everything possible. I’m not stuck in nearly as small of a box as someone like you who needs to force the square peg of reality into the round hole in your head.

    I pay attention to everything I can and consider possibilities deeply. You do damage control with an astonishing array of fallacies. That is why you have nothing to show nearly four years into this personal campaign against the Slayer of Unreason.

  151. Sad
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 11:48 am | Permalink

    Wait who’s the Slayer of Unreason?

    I missed her post.

  152. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    HW– I literally just showed that you linked to a fraudulent sock puppet post by some white US dude pretending to ba a Ghanain woman with the comment: “Nice message from Ghana. Trust me you aren’t winning brownie points with these folks.”

    Your next comment: “I pay attention to everything I can and consider possibilities deeply. You do damage control with an astonishing array of fallacies. ”

    No HW you are not a Slayer of Unreason. You are the very model of confirmation bias, self-delusion and blind follower.

  153. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 1:25 pm | Permalink

    The account had been live for 22 hours, HW! You literally can’t wait to jump on any bandwagon that passes by and clearly don’t do even the most cursory vetting before sharing and beating your chest.

  154. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 2:44 pm | Permalink

    Jean,

    What hinges on you being right that both accounts belong to Colin? I don’t get it. Is the content of the video fake? If not then you are earning no brownie points with the individuals in the video, right?

  155. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    “HW– I literally just showed that you linked to a fraudulent sock puppet post by some white US dude pretending to ba a Ghanain woman with the comment: “Nice message from Ghana. Trust me you aren’t winning brownie points with these folks.”

    You are so dumb it hurts to know there is someone that dumb out there. I don’t know if that account is what you say it is (probably not) but if it is then so what? The account is not pretending to be the people in the clip. Are you serious? You have no mind left to lose. It got permanently lost a long time ago. Your comprehension is that of a stupid child. Anons from all over the world and I mean ALL over are doing the same: posting personal video clips in solidarity with Q. No stupid Jean Henry fallacy can change that.

  156. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 3:32 pm | Permalink

    “some US dude”

    You sound so stupid right off the bat. A lot of “US dudes” would wreck you with knowledge and reason just as much as I do every day and some would do it better. You are on the extreme left of the Duning-Kruger curve every time and you don’t know it which supports the theory. You never know what you are talking about. I don’t care about the twitter account. It’s the message in the vid that I am concerned with. It’s wild how you dine on fallacy every day. It’s your favorite food.

    Some anon made a dub mix.

    https://twitter.com/deeepintheheart/status/1249229930107301888

  157. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    Haven’t heard from EOS lately. I hope all is well.

  158. Jean Henry
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 5:50 pm | Permalink

    HW— if you go to the twitter feed of the guy whose tweet you posted you will find he directs you to the ‘originator of the tweet’ and suggests people follow her. I provided the link to the fake account to which I am referring .

    It took me 5 minutes to figure out it’s bullShit.

    Now that sock puppet account is retweeting the originators posts. Naturally.

    And that dub mix. —bunch of idiots.

    FF— the video can be a real video and it can also be a fake, meaning as I suggested the woman is reading from. A cue card and was probably paid. She clearly is not the person who created an account claiming to be her, which is obviously fake, as it is 22 hours old. And the guy who shared the video did so immediately after it was posted. From some woman in Ghana who has only started posted 8 hours before hand mostly retweeting Donald Trump and Q propaganda.

    You guys are unbelievably gullible.

  159. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:17 pm | Permalink

    You are saying Phelomina @OptZazy is not the video originator’s account? What leads you to believe that? Even if it is not where did they get the fuckin’ VIDEO!!! What an incredible moron you are. Point is Africans, Middle Easterners, Indians, Chinese, Japanese, it goes on and on…are part of the Great Awakening. I daresay there is no region in the world where Q has not reached someone.

  160. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:24 pm | Permalink

    There are millions of accounts made every day, Jean. Why does a new account make you think ‘fake’? Again though, even if it is not their account which I am guessing it is, but even if it is not…the fuckin’ video was made by real live women and a man. I have no reason to doubt they are from Ghana. Do you? What is your problem with the twitter account exactly besides that it is new? You never think these things through.

  161. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 10:31 pm | Permalink

    Why don’t you contact @OptZazy and ask nicely for verification if you think it is so “obviously fake”. I don’t recommend doing anything that could remotely be considered harassing. A lot of people are now paying attention to that account and I’m sure it would not go over well to say the least. Do it though. I’d like to see if you can get one of your reckless claims right for once.

  162. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 12, 2020 at 11:04 pm | Permalink

    What do you mean the account has been live for 22 hours? Are you insane? Yes you are. Anyone can read their tweets and replies going back to 3/19/20. What the hell drives you to do this shit?

  163. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 4:27 am | Permalink

    Jean,

    I don’t think I am gullible. For me absolutely nothing hinges on the account or the video being genuine. I simply don’t care. Idon’t know about Q stuff. Are you saying it (whatever it is) is not spreading amongst different groups and around the globe?

  164. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 4:28 am | Permalink

    You seem extremely desperate to be right about something. Good luck on your journey.

  165. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 7:12 am | Permalink

    What do you think happens to her when she humiliates herself trying to malign us, Flakes? Does she melt and reconstitute the next day or what?

  166. Jean Henry
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 8:54 am | Permalink

    HW– As I said the account was opened March 20. It replied to three tweets until April 11th but tweeted nothing until April 11th when the video was posted.

    Some American dude just happened to find a tweet from a barnd new Ghanian account within minutes of it being posted and you find nothing strange about that? Do you understand how sical media algorithms work? Do you understand how sock puppets work and what they look like?

    And yes I reported the account as fake. Obviously I’m not going to ask a sock puppet account are you real? Twitter isn’t doing much vetting these days because of the pandemic, but I’m hopeful they’ll take the time to figure out it’s some white US dude pretending to be a Ghanaian Black Woman. The only way to be sure is to see the back end and connected emails.

  167. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 9:52 am | Permalink

    Too bad you won’t contact the account owner. Must be scared you are wrong. It’s you who does not understand what is happening. There are people from far-flung locations voicing support for Q all the time now. The “some guy” was contacted by @optZazy and ASKED to retweet their vid.

    Still though: what do you think that does to my point if you are correct? The Ghanaians are still there showing support and not giving a fuck about what you think.

  168. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 10:17 am | Permalink

    Rwanda

    https://twitter.com/qthewakeup/status/1248352053468020737

  169. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 10:37 am | Permalink

    Your sock puppet detector (brain) is busted no doubt. Who else thinks @optZazy is not the folks in the vid? To me it seems obviously authentic. They profess to be Christians and Q followers from Ghana and they sound like it.

  170. Jean Henry
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 11:15 am | Permalink

    They sound like they are reading a cue card. It’s not super hard to pay someone in Africa with American dollars to read some shit they don’t understand that sounds hopeful for a video.

    And yes they probably are Christian. And Evangelical Christian. Ghana has been heavily occupied by missionaries.

  171. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 11:20 am | Permalink

    It sounds to me like they prepared a heartfelt message and recited it as clearly as possible to make sure anyone who speaks English can understand them. It sounds like you are scared of Africans thinking for themselves. You won’t even allow yourself to hear it.

  172. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 11:29 am | Permalink

    So you have a Conspiracy Theory that they were paid to read a script and then someone created a fake account to pretend it’s them. I strongly doubt it. The only way to know would be if they replied immediately to a request for a unique identifying current picture. Since you think you are hot shit and are trying to get them busted why don’t you contact them directly?

  173. Posted April 13, 2020 at 2:03 pm | Permalink

    FF, I can only assume that you don’t consider those things based on the attitudes you express here. If you *DO* consider those things and still come to the same conclusions, I can only assume that you are actually a worse human being than I thought before.

    HW, haha. really? You claim that I was not expressing your words correctly and then double down with another racist statement? Ok. You do you. I am pretty confident that your racism is pretty obvious to most people

  174. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 2:20 pm | Permalink

    Your definition of racism is false. It’s unique to you and whoever in this world agrees with you. You qualify it. I don’t: discrimination based on race. That’s my definition. Therefore it is not racist to notice black people partying. I’m not discriminating. You are though by denying the EVIDENCE I posted in the form of video and press.

  175. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 2:23 pm | Permalink

    It doesn’t matter what you are “pretty confident” of. You have been extraordinarily overconfident about a lot of things you got wrong wrong wrong. You are going to keep getting it wrong until you start being right.

  176. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 2:29 pm | Permalink

    Princess Cassandra,

    What expressed attitude? What conclusion? Be specific.

    I can offer multiple instances where I have explained in very clear terms that structural racism and classism are obvious facts. Show me where I denied it once. You assume that people are moronic and you like to imagine you occupy the higher ground. It must have felt like it was some kind of huge epiphany when you realized that structural racism/ classism exists—to most other people it is an obvious fact. Why did it feel like an epiphany when it was obvious to others? Why are you obsessed with the thought as an explanation for all inequality? Why do you preach the gospel of structural racism/ classism in a way that attempts to demonize and smear others? Why do I call you Princess Cassandra?

  177. Sad
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 2:32 pm | Permalink

    We get it FF

    You like Trump

    Do you want a prize?

  178. stupid hick
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    It is inspiring to see Flakes finally concede that Warlock and Warlord are racist parodies of one another. Reading between the lines of course. It is deserving of a prize.

  179. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 9:37 pm | Permalink

    What a desperate loser SH must be… He thinks it is a winning strategy to pretend that his opponent is conceding points?

    I would love to see Bozo try to explain himself. I promise it will not go well for you but I still would like to see you try. How about it?

  180. Sad
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 10:32 pm | Permalink

    Why don’t you wrestle him FF?

  181. stupid hick
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 10:38 pm | Permalink

    “I can offer multiple instances where I have explained in very clear terms that HW’s racism and classism are obvious facts. Show me where I denied it once.”

    You are obtuse so please forgive me if I still don’t understand what your point is, but if you are in denial it is something you will have to discover for yourself.

  182. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 13, 2020 at 11:25 pm | Permalink

    You sound drunk.

  183. stupid hick
    Posted April 14, 2020 at 7:15 am | Permalink

    If I am incorrect it should be easy for you to point specifically to any past comment where you agree with HW that negroes as a group deserve blame for an action taken by individual negroes. If the point you’re trying to make is that you are in fact prejudiced please stop talking in generalities and point to a single concrete example.

  184. Sad
    Posted April 14, 2020 at 7:32 am | Permalink

    Why do you all keep trying to talk to him like a normal person?

  185. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 14, 2020 at 7:55 am | Permalink

    Do you call black people negroes to their face, stupid hick? Why would someone who uses racially offensive language try to make others seem racist? I would have no problem saying anything I have said here to black people or anyone partying during the shutdown because there is nothing wrong with what I said. I never blame all of any group for the actions of a few. You probably couldn’t repeat your characterization of me without getting your ass beat though.

  186. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 14, 2020 at 7:55 am | Permalink

    Aloha Sad, since we are all Biden fans now, are you rooting for Mayor Pete for VP? I know my choice has been totally ostracized by the Clintonites, but Pete has been cozy with Hillary. I thought his Barry imitation was acceptable.
    I agree with you, you can not have an honest discourse with people who live in other realities or are delusional.

  187. Sad
    Posted April 14, 2020 at 8:07 am | Permalink

    Pete is done.

    Be serious.

    I don’t even know why anyone would bother running against Trump.

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