what in the hell was john mccain thinking when he picked sarah palin?

    By now, you’ve all no doubt heard that John McCain selected the first-term governor of Alaska, Sarah Palin, to be his running-mate. As Palin has very little policy experience, and no foreign relations experience at all, one has to wonder, what the hell McCain, a 72 year old with health problems, was thinking. As she brings absolutely nothing to the ticket in the way of experience, maybe the folks at Salon are right and it’s just blatant tokenism.

    Is it just that she’s a woman? If so, how fucking insulting is that? Does McCain really think that all the pissed-off PUMAs (the “Party Unity My Ass” backers of Hillary Clinton) are going to flock to him just because he chose a running-mate with a uterus? Does he really think so poorly of women, that he believes they would fall for that? And, let’s say all of this is true, and he did just want a woman, thinking that it would help him to siphon votes away from the Obama/Biden ticket – why not choose Elizabeth Dole, or someone else with at least a little national recognition and experience? I’ve got to think that the Republican bench isn’t so thin when it comes to women that he had to go with someone that makes Dan Quayle look like Dwight D. Eisenhower.

    I’m sure we’ll hear a hell of a lot about Palin over the coming days – about her beautiful children, her love of firearms, the rugged individualism she exudes, and the fact that she makes a mean moose stew. I’m sure she’ll come across well initially. But, I suspect, once folks start digging, we’ll find that, not only does she have no experience, but she also brings some baggage with her. Already, stories are flying about her former brother-in-law, and how she attempted to use her office as Governor of Alaska, to have him fired from his job as a state trooper. And, it’s just a matter of time, I expect, before we start hearing about her ties to the oil industry (her husband is an oil man), and her dealings with Alaska’s corrupt Senator, Ted Stevens.

    But, I suppose, she’s about as far away from Bush/Cheney as McCain could get, and there’s clearly some value in that. Republicans fought it for a long time, but they’ve come to realize just how terrible President Bush is, and they want distance. Palin gives him that. And, being a former runner-up in the Miss Alaska beauty pageant, she’s somewhat photogenic. So, maybe that’s all there is to it, but I don’t trust these guys.

    I may be paranoid, but I’m thinking there’s something deeper. Maybe – and this is just me trying to think totally evil, like Karl Rove – she has something in her personal history that would put race in the forefront of this contest. Maybe she, or someone she loved, was once the victim of a crime that involved a black male. I know it’s a terrible thought, but maybe she’s just a back door way to insert race into the campaign somehow. McCain knows that three things have to happen for him to win this. He has to split the Democratic party, he has to make this about race, and he needs to distance himself from Bush. I’m thinking that there has to be a way that Palin helps him do all three. If not, I think he would have gone with someone else. (Damn you, Karl Rove, for making me think this way.)

    Or, maybe, he just chose her because he knew that Biden would gleefully destroy her in the Vice Presidential debate, thus perhaps driving more women to their side… I don’t see how the math works out better for them, though, than if he’d gone with someone who could deliver a swing state.

    If nothing else, it was good timing. Obama was riding the cresting wave of the Democratic National Convention when McCain made the announcement. Word is that 38 million Americans watched Obama’s acceptance speech last night. That’s more than watched the opening ceremony of the Olympics, the final episode of “American Idol,” and the Oscars. And, it’s more than double the number that tuned in to see John Kerry accept the Democratic nomination four years ago. McCain had to do something to change the news cycle. We can debate whether or not Palin was a good choice, but I don’t think there was any question that he had to make the VP announcement today.

    So, what do you think McCain was thinking?

    I posed the question to a few friends this afternoon and they responded, in unison, that, more than a running-mate, McCain was looking for the third Mrs. McCain.

    [Thanks to Jason and Maria for sending along this photo… which, I’m sorry to say, is probably real.]

    update: OK, it turns out that the photo included with this post is a fake. Sorry to get your hopes up. The photo of the body was taken three years ago in Georgia. It belongs to a then 23 year old woman. Palin’s head, however, was in its early 40′s. None of this means, however, that Palin has never handled a gun while wearing a bikini. I, like Americans everywhere, am still hopeful.

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      96 Comments

      1. designated republican
        Posted August 29, 2008 at 11:09 pm | Permalink

        Governor Palin is an exciting choice. Not only is she fiscally and socially a conservative, she hunts and fishes as well. She has proved herself to be a good executive, and shares McCain’s maverick streak. I thought he would pick Romney, but Palin is a good choice too.

      2. applejack
        Posted August 29, 2008 at 11:31 pm | Permalink

        She is an exciting choice at least, but her ties to Big Oil seem like the perfect opportunity for Dems to keep on yoking McCain to Bush. 8 years of oil men in office ending with record high gas prices as well as record profits makes his choice of another Oily politician seem pretty boneheaded. If Dems can’t take advantage of that angle god help’em.

      3. mark
        Posted August 29, 2008 at 11:51 pm | Permalink

        She apparently likes the idea of teaching Creationism in public schools.

      4. mark
        Posted August 29, 2008 at 11:52 pm | Permalink

        And I can’t really believe it, but, word is, Palin and McCain only met face-to-face one time… I guess it was one hell of a meeting.

      5. Reclusion
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 12:02 am | Permalink

        If anyone thinks thinks a BA in Journalism and second place in Miss Alaska contest can run our country, they are truly mindless.

        McCain fucked up big time.

      6. Reclusion
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 12:55 am | Permalink

        Fox news is already pushing the “vote for her and gas prices will go down” angle..

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNr_LZpMHqA&feature=related

      7. mark
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 7:47 am | Permalink

        And check out this Alaskan’s perspective.

      8. Posted August 30, 2008 at 8:31 am | Permalink

        McCain’s got this one locked up. Americans are just stupid enough to buy into this shit. I’m sure that more dirt will start piling up in the coming weeks about Palin but that won’t be enouigh to convince all the idiot voters out there who will eat this up. What a sad day for McCain that he has to resort to such lame tactics to win an election. There were plenty of decent candidates for VP regardless of gender and he turned away from them in favor of a moron.

      9. Posted August 30, 2008 at 8:51 am | Permalink

        Since when does hunting and fishing make one a good candidate? Why do “designated Republicans” think that emulating traditionally masculine qualities makes a good politician? It didn’t work for Bush.

      10. designated republican
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:30 am | Permalink

        dude [Visitor] · http://www.dude.com
        Since when does hunting and fishing make one a good candidate? Why do “designated Republicans” think that emulating traditionally masculine qualities makes a good politician? It didn’t work for Bush.

        In the real world, hunting and fishing are not exclusively masculine activities. You should try it sometime, you might enjoy it too. You’re right though about the risks for some politicians who try to emulate traditionally masculine qualities when they ought to know better. John Kerry tried putting on hunting gear and buying an Ohio hunting license in 2004, and the stunt became a political embarrassment. Of course, Kerry was trying to “emulate” (read “pretend to be”) a regular guy. What I like about Governor Palin is she lives her beliefs, no pretending she is something she’s not.

      11. Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:56 am | Permalink

        I think the best explanation I’ve heard so far is, “McCain’s strategists really don’t have any clue how to win this election.”

        So far, it seems like the biggest thing Palin brings to the ticket is not the disaffected Clinton vote, but conservative cred -

        Mr. McCain’s pick, Ms. Palin, who opposes abortion, played especially well among evangelicals and other social conservatives, who have always viewed Mr. McCain warily and who have been jittery in recent weeks because of reports that Mr. McCain was considering naming a running mate who favors abortion rights.

        “They’re beyond ecstatic,” said Ralph Reed, the former head of the Christian Coalition. Ms. Palin is known to conservatives for opting not to have an abortion after learning that the child she was carrying, her youngest, had Down syndrome. “It is almost impossible to exaggerate how important that is to the conservative faith community,” Mr. Reed said.

        McCain’s still too busy worrying about whether his own base will show up on Election Day to make any serious play for disaffected Clintonites? Desperation.

        As one friend of mine noted, “Trying to win a turnout fight with the Obama machine (which is a very different thing than the Democratic machine) is to bring a knife to a gun fight,” especially if the Clinton machines are riding shotgun.

      12. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 10:54 am | Permalink

        Palin doesn’t have much experience. However she served as governor for more than 143 days.

        http://www.democrats.org/page/community/post/janeheffelfinger/CxQ4

      13. nammeroo
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 11:20 am | Permalink

        Prediction: Obama/Biden will win Washtenaw County; McCain/Palin will win Michigan and the Presidency.

        Like it or not, Putting Palin on the ticket has energized the conservative base of the Republican Party. With McCain’s preference for wooing “Reagan Democrats” and Palin’s “conservative cred” and “outside-the-Beltway cred” bringing independents and social conservatives back into McCain’s campaign, it does look ugly for Senator Obama.

      14. Dirtgrain
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 12:32 pm | Permalink

        “Like it or not, Putting Palin on the ticket has energized the conservative base of the Republican Party.”

        What’s with all these spin doctors jumping the gun? How the crap did you so quickly measure the level to which the Republican Party has been energized in the few days since Palin was chosen?

      15. nammeroo
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 12:40 pm | Permalink

        1. McCain raised $4 Million online in new contributions overnight after the Palin VP announcement.

        2. Here is a representative sample of comments on conservative blogs:

        “YEY SARAH PALIN! YEY John McCain! Great pick! The 1st woman for the GOP VP? SCORE! She’s conservative! SCORE! She’s a Governor! SCORE! She’s pro-drilling! She’s a hunter! SCORE! She’s a hockey Mom and played basketball in school! SCORE! She’s pro-life! And she respects women! SCORE! She fights corruption! SCORE! She’s high-energy! SCORE! She’s tough! SCORE! She’s got 5 kids! SCORE! Her son is going to Iraq in the Armed Forces! SCORE! She’s married to a Blue-collar professional! SCORE! She’s smart! SCORE! She’s young! SCORE! And she’s a Hotty to boot! SCORE! The Left is going to go nuts! SCORE!”

        Those conservatives, they just get wild and crazy sometimes. Especially when their chances for winning in November went from 3:2 against to 4:1 in favor with one little announcement.

      16. Dirtgrain
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 1:01 pm | Permalink

        1. So you say.
        2. Quantitative?

      17. Posted August 30, 2008 at 1:17 pm | Permalink

        Why is hunting and fishing an issue at all? Why do republicans think that democrats will take that away somehow? It’s just absurd thinking, and scary to think that some people vote republican because of that!

        I hunt and fish and own a gun and a bow, but I’m not worried in the least that Obama would take that from me. And I could care less that Palin is a hunter or her husband’s a hunter or that she (like me) played basketball in high school! And I could care less about her beauty contest. We’re talking about the VP here! None of those things matter AT ALL! She’s not running for homecoming queen!

        I’m pumped about this choice too, republicans (SCORE!). Let’s see how she does when questioned about actual issues that matter. Let’s see how she stacks up against Biden. Maybe you’re right ytown, her 143 PLUS days as governor of Alaska will be plenty of experience for her.

        And maybe, instead of debating, the VPs can face off in a game of one-on-one basketball or have a bass-catching contest.

      18. Dirtgrain
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

        From the link that Mark posted above (an Alaskan’s perspective):

        “I had a good chuckle at MSN.com’s claim that she had been the mayor of “Wasilla City”. It is not a city. Just Wasilla. Wasilla is the heart of the Alaska “Bible belt” and Sarah was raised amongst the tribe that believes creationism should be taught in our public schools, homosexuality is a sin, and life begins at conception. She’s a gun-toting, hang ‘em high conservative. Remember…this is where her approval ratings come from. There is no doubt that McCain again is making a strategic choice to appeal to a particular demographic – fundamentalist right-wing gun-owning Christians. And Republican bloggers are already gushing about how she has ‘more executive experience’ than Obama does! Above is a picture of lovely downtown Wasilla, for those of you unfamiliar with the area. Behind the Mug-Shot Saloon (the first bar I visited when I moved to Alaska long ago) is a little strip mall. There are street signs in Wasilla with bullet holes in them. Wasilla has a population of about 5500 people, and 1979 occupied housing units. This is where your potential Vice President was two short years ago.”

        How the hell can anybody think she is ready to lead our country? Yikes.

        Here is a timeline of her political work (from http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080829/ap_on_el_ge/cvn_palin_timeline):

        1982 — Graduated from Wasilla High School in Wasilla, Alaska.

        1987 — Graduated with a bachelor’s degree in journalism from the University of Idaho.

        August 29, 1988 — Married Todd Palin, whom she would have five children with.

        1992-1996 — Entered public life, serving two terms on the Wasilla City Council.

        1996-2002 — Elected mayor of Wasilla City, Alaska, for two terms until term limits forced her from office.

        2002 — Lost her first statewide campaign for the GOP nomination for lieutenant governor.

        2002 — Frank Murkowski left the Senate to become governor and named Palin chairwoman of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission.

        2003 — Split with the party leaders by battling Randy Ruedrich, the head of Alaska’s Republican Party.

        2006 — Upset then-Gov. Murkowski in the Republican primary, then defeated former two-term Gov. Tony Knowles, a Democrat, in the general election.

        2007 — Pressured lawmakers to get the Alaska Gasline Inducement Act passed, to build a natural gas pipeline to deliver 35 trillion cubic feet of North Slope natural gas to market.

      19. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 3:00 pm | Permalink

        Is this guy ready to lead our country? Double Yikes!!

        1988 – Obama is a summer associate at the Chicago law firm Sidley & Austin

        1992 – Obama graduates from Harvard and returns to Chicago

        1992 – Oct – Obama marries fellow attorney Michelle Robinson

        1995 – Jul – Obama, at 34, publishes his first memoir, “Dreams From My Father: A Story of Race and Inheritance”

        1995 – Aug – Obama files paperwork to run for Palmer’s Illinois Senate seat

        1996 – Jan – Obama has his four competitor petitions invalidated; he emerges as the only candidate

        1996 – Nov – Obama is elected to Illinois Senate, which is controlled by Republicans

        1999 – Obama begins running for Congress

        2000 – Obama loses his challenge for Congressional seat held by Rep. Bobby Rush

        2001 – Obama receives legal services contract with Illinois firm owned by Robert Blackwell, Jr. A few months later, Obama writes a letter on Illinois Senate letterhead in support of a tourism grant for a different Blackwell company. The next day, “Obama’s U.S. Senate campaign received a $1,000 donation from Blackwell… In the presidential race he is credited on Obama’s website with committing to raise $100,000 to $200,000 for Obama’s campaign.”

        Obama reported $98,158 income for providing legal services; $80,000 was from Blackwell’s firm.”Illinois ethics disclosure forms are designed to reveal possible financial conflicts by lawmakers… Obama did not specify that EKI provided him with the bulk of the private-sector compensation he received… he attached a multi-page list of all the law firm’s clients, which included EKI among hundreds.”

        2002 Nov – Democrats usurp Republican control of the Illinois Senate

        2003-2004 – Obama amasses his legislative record, serves as chair of the Health and Human Services Committee

        2003 – Obama begins running for US Senate; the leading Democratic candidate will withdraw in 2004 due to a sex scandal that Obama’s campaign urged the Chicago Tribune to report.

        2003 – David Axelrod [begins having] camera crews [track] virtually everything Obama has done in public.” He uses this footage to create a five-minute Internet video for the 16 Jan. 2007 announcement that Obama is running for president.

        2004, Mar – Obama wins the primary with 52% of the vote

        2004, Jun – Obama’s Republican opponent withdraws due to sex scandal

        2004, Aug – Democratic National Convention address

        2004, Nov – Obama is elected to US Senate with 70% of the vote

        2005, Jan – Obama files paperwork for his leadership PAC, The Hope Fund (PAC website no longer active)

        2005 – Obama purchases land from neighbor and now-indicted political fundraiser Antoin “Tony” Rezko

        2005 – “Shortly after his election to the U.S. Senate, he delivered a well-received address arguing faith should have a greater role in public discourse.”

        2006 – Obama publishes the book, The Audacity of Hope

        2006, Oct 22 – Obama announces he is considering a run for the Presidency.
        2007, Jan – Obama begins running for US President

        2007, Mar – Obama endorses controversial Chicago alderman Dorothy “The Hat” Tillman, who reportedly “[deployed] city resources to hire her family and reward campaign contributors.”

        2007, Apr – Controversy over Obama’s MySpace page

        2007, May – Obama’s campaign releases its sophisticated Facebook application, only hours “after the company launched the developer platform.” TechPresident argues that Facebook gave the Obama camp an advantage: “the other campaigns found out about Platform’s with the rest of us, on Friday, May 25″ and reports that “Chris Hughes, a co-founder of Facebook, is working on the Obama campaign.”

      20. Posted August 30, 2008 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

        Of course, I know absolutely nothing here about this. But I am guessing that McCain et al picked her first because she is the kind of candidate that the base is really excited about– guns, god, oil, pro-life, a woman, etc.- because it will mean that McCain will not have any vp to overshadow him in some way, and because it makes him look a little more virile to be standing next to yet another handsome woman.

        Besides the fact that she doesn’t have a whole lot of experience and everything else, she doesn’t bring anything in terms of delegates/region to the ticket (guess what? Alaska was gonna vote McCain no matter what), while you can make a good argument that Biden helps bring Pennsylvania along. Biden is a very capable attack dog; is Palin capable of that traditional vp role?

        Of course, let’s not forget about Dan Quayle. He was a pretty dumb-ass choice for VP too, but things turned out pretty well for the Republicans in ’88, a year when Dukakis was well in the lead in the summer and before Quayle was chosen. Of Quayle’s choice back then, wikipedia says “Quayle was chosen to appeal to a younger generation of Americans and his looks were praised by Senator John McCain, who said ‘I can’t believe a guy that handsome wouldn’t have some impact.’”

        Kinda creepy, ain’t it?

      21. Robert
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

        Hey Mark! I wrote those jokes! The one about looking for a 3rd wife and the oilman stuff are my lines. You and your friends are stealing my material. It’s not that I’m mad about that. I just don’t think anybody in their right mind would steal MY material. If I were your advisor, I strongly suggest you dump me as your writer. But as your writer, I want to say what a strikingly handsome advisor you have.

        Since you guys wanna steal my material so bad, here’s some more. To my friends I’ve been referring to McCain’s VP announcement in Dayton yesterday as his “senior moment.” Hey, and what about my “Misogynists for Obama” jokes? Why didn’t those make the cut? You have editing rights ya know. This stuff is just the raw material…like comedy ore. I’ll mine it and you can refine it.

        You saw my initial reaction though, right? I absolutely love this development! Palin is a hilariously bad choice. And it’s funny to watch all the mindless drone neo-con dopes immediately start pretending they think it is a good one. I love that ‘circus of phonies’ atmosphere that’s broken out now. I feel like a little kid again! I want to throw a party or something.

        It’s again very apparent to me that the political campaign experience of the goofballs commenting here on this, is extremely limited. They don’t even seem to pay any attention to what the most reliable sources out there are saying about McCain’s choice. That’s not to say that some true points haven’t been made. I even like ytown’s Obama history lesson. It’s too bad he finds it impossible to look at similar information regarding his heroes. God, I do love the chaos though. I think I might very well be The Joker to your site’s Gotham, Mark. I’ve been giggling like a schoolgirl since yesterday.

        Do you remember what I predicted about McCain’s choice? I fully expected it to be Romney, but thought there was only one other possibility, and that was that he would select a lower-tier military industrial stooge like Giuliani but without the skeletons. Remember that comment. Now, do you see who this Palin character is? She’s like a female Dubya, but with the capacity to speak in coherent sentences.

        Have any of you folks been looking at the electoral map at all? You do remember that THAT is actually how we select our presidents don’t you? You people should really study harder…and you should be ashamed hearing that from a guy with my scholastic record.

      22. designated republican
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 4:40 pm | Permalink

        Comment from: Steve Krause [Visitor] · “…Biden is a very capable attack dog; is Palin capable of that traditional vp role?”

        Sure, and it appears that she can do it with a smile on her face in a way that her opponent has no idea what happened to him. It must be something they teach in beauty contestant school….

      23. Robert
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 4:47 pm | Permalink

        That’s awesome, designated republican. This is pure comedy gold. Hey, designated republican, wanna bet me an enchelada Palin starts crying at events? She named her kids WILLOW and TRIG! Don’t you get it? You have to come out of that trance buddy. You could walk into traffic like that. Oh, wait, maybe it’s that you’re not getting out of the house…maybe you’ll be ok.

      24. Robert
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 4:52 pm | Permalink

        I will say this about Palin…she doesn’t appear to be coked up at all, and she only looks a little tipsy.

      25. Posted August 30, 2008 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

        I do not understand what kind of mother she can be if she’s trying to move up the ladder in american politics. I doubt she has much time to carry her kids to hockey practice. I love it when these politicians use their kids as a lever to get votes. My thought is that they must have little time to spend with them.

        As for hunting and fishing, while I understand that you believe that makes her “regular folks”, I fail to see how being “regular folks” will help you be a U.S. president. Most “regular folks” can’t even figure out their home loans let alone balance their checking account. I fear the day when “regular folks” become heads of state in a economically complex world, not to mention problems of foreign policy and national security.

        Look, we had a guy who claimed he was “regular folks” and look what a mess he made. Admittedly, Bush is far from being “regular”, but that’s the platform he ran on.

        I would like to see professionals in office. I would like to see people who are educated in legal matters and political history. I don’t want to see “hockey moms” who run states with less people than many cities.

        McCain wanted a token vagina and he got one. It’s too bad he passed over so many qualified people to get one. What a loser.

      26. NICK
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 7:36 pm | Permalink

        The only real question here is “Will she be able to handle the heat while McCain is out of the kitchen?” He’s 72 years old and not in the best of health. Do you really want someone who has been the Mayor of a town of 9000 people and the Governor of the state for 18 months next in line when John takes a header? Go ahead Republicans, send us down the same road you took us in 2004, you’ll have no one to blame then but yourselves. Even Obama has more experience than she does, ao much for your experience argument/

      27. Posted August 30, 2008 at 8:17 pm | Permalink

        I wonder if she’ll cry in the Biden debates to make him look bad.

      28. LAKE
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 8:58 pm | Permalink

        My guess is that somehow the McCain campaign will be talking about drilling for oil in Alaska soon.

      29. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 8:59 pm | Permalink

        No comment on these?

        1996 – Jan – Obama has his four competitor petitions invalidated; he emerges as the only candidate

        2001 – Obama receives legal services contract with Illinois firm owned by Robert Blackwell, Jr. A few months later, Obama writes a letter on Illinois Senate letterhead in support of a tourism grant for a different Blackwell company. The next day, “Obama’s U.S. Senate campaign received a $1,000 donation from Blackwell… In the presidential race he is credited on Obama’s website with committing to raise $100,000 to $200,000 for Obama’s campaign.”

        Obama reported $98,158 income for providing legal services; $80,000 was from Blackwell’s firm.”Illinois ethics disclosure forms are designed to reveal possible financial conflicts by lawmakers… Obama did not specify that EKI provided him with the bulk of the private-sector compensation he received… he attached a multi-page list of all the law firm’s clients, which included EKI among hundreds.”

        2003 – Obama begins running for US Senate; the leading Democratic candidate will withdraw in 2004 due to a sex scandal that Obama’s campaign urged the Chicago Tribune to report.

        2004, Jun – Obama’s Republican opponent withdraws due to sex scandal

        2005 – Obama purchases land from neighbor and now-indicted political fundraiser Antoin “Tony” Rezko

        2007, May – Obama’s campaign releases its sophisticated Facebook application, only hours “after the company launched the developer platform.” TechPresident argues that Facebook gave the Obama camp an advantage: “the other campaigns found out about Platform’s with the rest of us, on Friday, May 25″ and reports that “Chris Hughes, a co-founder of Facebook, is working on the Obama campaign.”

        I assume liberals just want this swept under the rug.

      30. Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

        What’s to comment on?

      31. Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:12 pm | Permalink

        I read it again and fail to see what’s so scandalous here.

      32. Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:20 pm | Permalink

        Am I the only person in the world who gets completely tired of the constant polarization of “liberals” and “conservatives”? There is something extremely juvenile about this sort of thinking. Like “shirts” vs. “skins”… Personally, I hate football.

      33. nammeroo
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:48 pm | Permalink

        Obama’s tactics are well known. He uses the same playbook that Hillary consulted, Rules for Radicals by Saul Alinsky. Required reading in my high school. Ugly, thuggish, and hardly becoming of the one some call The One.

      34. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:55 pm | Permalink

        Are you serious Dude? Do a little research would you. Look up Tony Rezko for one thing.

        I know you are an Obama supporter, but try and educate yourself on your candidate.

      35. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 9:58 pm | Permalink

        No comment Mark? For someone who like to hear himself speak, I would think you would have an opinion, or at least a rebuttal. or a denial. or you would just ignore it. Oops never mind.

      36. Posted August 30, 2008 at 10:42 pm | Permalink

        I never said that I supported Obama. However, I’m not impressed with your list. I’ve seen much worse.

      37. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 11:50 pm | Permalink

        Dude, I’m am not trying to impress you, and it is not MY list it is Obama’s.

        BTW, what list have you seen that is “much worse”?

      38. ytown
        Posted August 30, 2008 at 11:51 pm | Permalink

        Dude, if you never said that you supported Obama, then who do you support?

      39. Little richard
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 9:17 am | Permalink

        What’s worse that Obama’s minor league influence dealing is McCain’s major league involvment in this stuff. His campaign is run by influence peddlers, aka Washington lobbyists! Palin is a oil industry patsy who denies climate change is caused by human actions! McCain continues to get a free ride for his savings and loan corruption of 20 years ago.

        As for Palin’s hunter background – yeah, it’s not wise to pick national leaders based on their recreational activities, but in some states the fear that the Feds are gonna take away hunters’ guns is a real factor in elections. Look at Missouri, W.Virginia, Wisconsin, and rural sections of Michigan. Howard Dean has rightly identified this fear as a major plus for the GOP in recent elections.

      40. Posted August 31, 2008 at 9:22 am | Permalink

        Personally, I think McCain’s choice of Palin has turned his campaign into a true joke. I want to puke everytime I see Palin’s “happy pill” face and want to puke again when I think of all the female politicians that he could have chosen in her place, Susan Collins and Elizabeth Dole being at the top of the list. One can only assume that McCain wants to turn his campaign into a contest of celebrity and not a contest of what-to-do-about-America.

        I thought I like McCain before. I even voted for him in the Michigan primary just to avoid Romney. Now I think he’s the biggest loser in politics. I have to say that he’s worse than Bush. What a great disappointment.

      41. mark
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 12:12 pm | Permalink

        I’m not sure what you’re talking about, ytown. Did you ask me a question?

      42. ytown
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 1:58 pm | Permalink

        Mark, if you don’t know what I’m talking about, then maybe you are not as smart or clever as you think you are.

      43. Guy
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

        Can you help us out ytown? Take them one at a time. What’s the scandal here?

        1996 – Jan – Obama has his four competitor petitions invalidated; he emerges as the only candidate

      44. mark
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 6:45 pm | Permalink

        The only question I saw was, “Is this guy ready to lead our country?” And that was followed by a selective list of things about Obama’s history that may or may not be true. I didn’t think your question needed an answer, as I already said that I was supporting Obama, but, here, if it makes you happy, is my response.

        “Yes. I do think this guy is ready to lead.”

      45. mark
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 10:04 pm | Permalink

        And Palin does apparently have foreign policy experience… seeing as how Alaska is close to Russia.

      46. Ol' E Cross
        Posted August 31, 2008 at 11:30 pm | Permalink

        Within minutes of the announcement, I received this mass e-mail from a smart, public school teaching, evangelical friend:

        Friends,
        I have been seriously sitting out the 08 presidential elections because. . . well, I can’t stand the politics of Obama and I’m tired of the chest-thumping of McCain and the idiot neo-cons who pulled us into Iraq. However, John McCain’s pick of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin (did I get her first name right?) is surprising and refreshing. She’s a mother of five, her husband owns a commericial fishing business, her eldest is scheduled to deploy to Iraq next month, her youngest has Down’s Syndrome, and she isn’t a tool of the oil industry. Oh yeah, she’s also a member of Feminists for Life. So. . . my interest is piqued. I may just walk down to Hilbert Middle School in November and vote for president. I’ll be praying and wisely considering.
        Pax Christi,
        (name omitted)

        Followed by this mass response, from another smart, social activist evangelical friend:

        Things have been interesting for many months. It’s not just getting interesting now. Unlike you, (name omitted), I have never, in my lifetime, been more excited about a candadate. I embrace the politics of Obama. His life story is inspirational and he is good news for the poor and working class. He moves and inspires me and most of his policy initiatives match my hopes for change in this country. I work and live in an African American environment and the pride and joy I see is infectious. Yet, he also speaks truth to that community about family life, male responsibility, personal responsibility and more. I have not been so moved since Bobby Kennedy.

        So, he may have been thinking that evangelical sample one, who wasn’t gonna vote, may vote now…whether or not he’s sure how to spell her name.

      47. Bored With Ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 12:53 am | Permalink

        Ytown, please tell me I don’t know enough, that I’m not reading your comments closely enough, that I’m not providing any substantial arguments or insightful rebuttals to your comments, etc., etc. Please, go ahead. It’ll make you feel wonderful and make me look stupid (or convince you that that’s the case).

        Or, at least do something else that makes this post sound as if I don’t know what the fuck I’m talking about. That’d be wonderful, as well. I really don’t care. I just wanted to say that your trite ad hominem shit you’ve for the most part cut and pasted on this thread is quite lame.

        That’s all I have the energy for.

        Oh, wait. I have the energy for one more comment: your idiocy in thinking that w/in about 24 hours that Mark is sitting on his ass just waiting to respond to your crap! Get over yourself. (And please, get over McCain.)

      48. egpenet
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 9:08 am | Permalink

        McCain’s staff may pay a terrible price for not vetting Sarah Palin.

        I have been following the rumor mill in the Anchorage newspapers … that Trig Palin, allegedly Sarah Palin’s child, is actually the child of her daughter. The unconfirmed trail of lies and deceptions is incredible, if true.

        What may, in fact, disrupt the nomination in Minneapolis is not a hurricane, but a “her”ricane.

        Robert – get on this one. Or do you care?

      49. Posted September 1, 2008 at 9:31 am | Permalink

        I found this:

        http://www.cafepress.com/irregularstates.96558359

        I think everyone should buy it.

      50. Posted September 1, 2008 at 9:37 am | Permalink

        Personally, I think it’s true. How could people NOT know she was pregnant at 7 MONTHS? And at 44, you have to wonder how her figure could bounce back so fast. I think there’s a scandal here, but the repuglicans will most certainly put some moral spin on it and come out shining.

      51. nammeroo
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 9:48 am | Permalink

        …and the political discussion takes its usual mm.com course into the sublime and ridiculous (at least the latter)….

      52. Posted September 1, 2008 at 12:04 pm | Permalink

        An article on the “Palin is the Grandmother of her retarded son” wackiness.

        If true, I love it. It’s like a fucking episode of Dallas up in here.

      53. Dirtgrain
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

        Palin’s daughter is pregnant (the article says she is a teenager, but I don’t know how old she is, or if she is married–not that it upsets me, but it’s an interesting story coming from a anti-sex education candidate): http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272622446.shtml

      54. Dirtgrain
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:36 pm | Permalink

        Oh, she’s 17 and they say she plans on getting married to the father: http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/09/bristol_palin_is_pregnant.html

      55. Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

        Yeah, but how long til the divorce? Good god, this campaign is pathetic. Not but 4 days in and we are already having discussions of family scandals. I’m sure the public will eat it up but it runs completely counter to McCain’s Paris Hilton/Barack Obama slam ad. What the fuck was he thinking?

      56. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

        Ok Guy, here it is one at a time:

        “Can you help us out ytown? Take them one at a time. What’s the scandal here?

        1996 – Jan – Obama has his four competitor petitions invalidated; he emerges as the only candidate “

        Read this article if you care,

        http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/29/obamas.first.campaign/index.html

        It is the beginning of his questionable morals in regards to his campaigns.

      57. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

        Why is it so many of you love to use the word fuck? Do you think you don’t look like pansy libs if you swear a lot? You still sound like pansies!

      58. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 2:59 pm | Permalink

        Bored with Ytown,
        If you are so bored stop reading what I say and stop replying. Personally, I don’t care how you feel. I’m expressing my opinion, just as you.

        “Oh, wait. I have the energy for one more comment: your idiocy in thinking that w/in about 24 hours that Mark is sitting on his ass just waiting to respond to your crap! Get over yourself. (And please, get over McCain.)”

        I guess it’s just you that sits on your ass waiting for my comments.

      59. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:00 pm | Permalink

        As far as Sarah Palin goes, she won’t be McCain’s VP for long. She will drop out to “focus” on her family.

      60. Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:00 pm | Permalink

        And? That is supposed to change peoples political leanings in what way? If you look at ANY candidate, or ANY person for that matter, you can find a grocery list of indiscretions and moral failings. If you dig, you can find it. Even Christ himself was known to have temper tantrums.

        How about we see your list, ytown?

      61. Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

        I read the article. Personally, I like him more now. I didn’t like him before, but now I REALLY like him. I want to see someone who plays hardball to get in the presidential office. Especially if they are concerned about social disparities and fighting same old, same old old white guy politics.

        Presidents have to be willing to play tough in the field or they will get squashed. The republicans have used this strategy for years. It’s about time someone else did, too.

      62. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:14 pm | Permalink

        Dude what are you talking about? Of course everybody as skeletons, but some are bigger than others.

        Dude no body cares who you are and nobody wants to see your list or mine. We are not running for President of The United States!

        Try to have a point next time.

      63. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:18 pm | Permalink

        Dude these are not the robber baron days where behind every great fortune was a great crime. I want someone who can lead with morals and who can win on leadership and experience, not someone who systematically discredits and invalidate his opponenets. Is Obama this person?

      64. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:19 pm | Permalink

        I know there are some typos. I’m sure someone will comment. Sorry. I know professors are reading this! Yikes

      65. Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:50 pm | Permalink

        “Dude these are not the robber baron days where behind every great fortune was a great crime. I want someone who can lead with morals and who can win on leadership and experience, not someone who systematically discredits and invalidate his opponenets.”

        So… the question is… who do you plan to vote for exactly?

        I was going to vote for McCain, but I will not vote for Obama, thanks to your article.

      66. Posted September 1, 2008 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

        I guess, since your at it ytown, you might like to read about your candidate.. I knew of these things before I you enlightened me to Obama’s ball busting. McCain does not have much moral ground to stand on.

        http://www.realchange.org/mccain.htm

      67. Posted September 1, 2008 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

        I’m sorry, I misspoke, thanks to ytown, I am most definitely going to vote for Obama. I had a typo above.

        McCain has lost my vote due to his pisspoor selection of a running mate. I think that Obama actually wants to be president and will do anything to get there, a quality I can respect.

        It’s possible that McCain just cares about getting laid. Perhaps his drug-addled wife isn’t putting out anymore.

      68. ytown
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 4:25 pm | Permalink

        Dude, you are voting for Obama in spite of me? You are an idiot! Use your own judgement.

      69. Posted September 1, 2008 at 4:39 pm | Permalink

        I have used my own judgement along with the materials you provided. I am voting for Obama. I was going to vote for McCain, but now I realize that McCain is just not strong enough for the job. As long as he is still pandering to freaky Christians and southern housewives like his predecessors, I cannot support him.

        Obama can play with the snakes, he’s my man. We need a candidate who’s not afraid the get his hands dirty and isn’t afraid to take want he wants, regardless of press and so called “morality”. As Spock said, the needs of the many outweight the needs of the few and of the one.

        Thank you for enlightening me, ytown.

      70. elviscostello
        Posted September 1, 2008 at 10:07 pm | Permalink

        ABC reported today that McCain sent a team of 10, including some GOP lawyers to Alaska to “post-vet” Sarah Palin. Now it appears that she was a member of the Alaska Independent Party, attended their convention. They believe that Alaska should secede from the United States. She also has to give a depo in the Trooper-gate scandal. She also endorsed Obama’s energy plan and turns out, didn’t oppose “the bridge to nowhere”, and was not happy when it was deleted from the budget. I believe that she won’t last the week. However, McCain is in a bad spot. If he dumps her, his decision making is in question, and if he keeps her, and more scandals come out, he has an Eagleton on his hands.

      71. Posted September 1, 2008 at 10:56 pm | Permalink

        Obama announced today that Palin’s family (and everybody’s family) should be off-limits in this campaign, that it has nothing to do with a person’s political ability. Total class-act thing for Obama to say. Obama also chose not to attack McCain in his speech in Detroit today, choosing instead to offer a prayer for the hurricane victims.

        Also – there’s no way that McCain is going to dump her – that would look so wishy-washy that it would be a disaster for him. He’s stuck with her now.

      72. Robert
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 9:04 am | Permalink

        Egpenet, I’m laughing to hard to type. I told you all the moment I found out who McCain “picked” that I LOVED this hilarious choice.

        I don’t think I’ve ever liked ytown more. This is awesome! I’ll chime in later, or maybe never. I haven’t had this much fun since I started reading this little Internet rag of Mark’s.

      73. Robert
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 9:14 am | Permalink

        Oh, I will say this…though you are all hitting on good points in my opinion (including ytown) and there’s some truth to all of it, I think you are all missing the bigger picture and the core reality here.

        This whole fiasco must look pretty bizarre to most people, but it’s making more hilarious sense to me by the moment.

        I think you all can forget about Palin being dropped from the ticket. You’re all way off on that one. I don’t think you’re understanding the true process by which a running mate is chosen. It’s not done on a whim as so many seem to be trying to suggest.

      74. Robert
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 10:49 am | Permalink

        Those of you who don’t have me on ‘ignore’ might remember my earlier pondering on who McCain might select for his VP. The closest I could come to predicting this was to say “The only other possibility in my mind is that he will be pressured into taking some lower tier, criminally connected, military industrial stooge like Giuliani, but likely with far fewer skeletons of the publically discernable kind.” It appears to me I got it more than part right. You could hardly go any lower-tier than Palin, and she’s really just another brain-dead Dubya. If I were McCain, I would do everything I could to lose this election now. He actually SHOULD get caught boffin’ Palin, if he knows what’s good for him.

      75. designated republican
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 11:12 am | Permalink

        Please do not listen to Senator Obama – keep ranting about Sarah Palin! Every rumor spread, every picture posted – all of it disrupts the media’s (fading) obsession with Obama and solidifies the public’s positive feelings about McCain’s VP pick. Great stuff…keep it up!

      76. Robert
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 12:31 pm | Permalink

        Don’t worry, designated republican, none of this is going to go any further than the stories about Dubya’s cocaine trafficking and links to the Bin Ladens. Palin’s a carbon copy of Dubya…BUT HOT! I’m on board!

      77. kjc
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

        Did someone already say it’s photoshopped? I don’t have the patience to read the comments to find out. But why people are posting this stupid pic is beyond me.

      78. Castor
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 3:10 pm | Permalink

        http://www.secretsofsarahpalin.com/2008/09/01/10-pictures-sarah-palin-doesnt-want-you-to-see/

        I thought so too, but the photo is real.

      79. kjc
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 3:23 pm | Permalink

        This doesn’t prove the photo is real.

      80. Robert
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

        It would be fun to ask her at one of her events. I wonder if I could get her to autograph a copy of that picture for me. I’m going to need something to put up on the walls of my cell in gitmo.

      81. Posted September 2, 2008 at 4:18 pm | Permalink

        Castor, don’t you READ the stuff you link to? For a more “original” look at the bikini girl/gun photo, try this one:
        http://flickr.com/photos/97897149@N00/208036176

        Mark, as much as I enjoyed the VP-in-a-bikini image, maybe it’s time to actually try vetting the information in your republican-bashing posts for five minutes before going off another rhetorical cliff….

      82. Clawfoot Tub
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 4:57 pm | Permalink

        Am I the only one that thinks the Palin version looks much more real than the one people are claiming to be the original? That girl has a pea head.

      83. ytown
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 5:41 pm | Permalink

        “[Thanks to Jason and Maria for sending along this photo… which, I’m sorry to say, is probably real.]“

        Wow more insight from mark!

      84. Guy
        Posted September 2, 2008 at 7:47 pm | Permalink

        1996 – Jan – Obama has his four competitor petitions invalidated; he emerges as the only candidate “

        Read this article if you care,

        http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/29/obamas.first.campaign/index.html

        Hmmm. I’m not left with the dirty taste in my mouth you were probably hoping for. It was legal. And there isn’t really proof of anything underhanded. It could have been a morally questionable thing to do. It could also have been not questionable at all. What if Obama’s camp looked over the signatures and saw sheet after sheet obviously hand written by the same person? So they reported it. Who knows? There isn’t really any smoking gun here for me.

      85. mark
        Posted September 3, 2008 at 7:55 am | Permalink

        Thanks for the correction on the photo. I changed the text to reflect that it’s a fake… And, for what it’s worth, when I first put it up I did so with the caveat that it might not be real. I, however, you’re right, thought that it was…

      86. Robert
        Posted September 3, 2008 at 10:46 am | Permalink

        Palin is better looking in every way, and I didn’t think she’d waste her time with a BB gun.

      87. Quidam
        Posted September 3, 2008 at 5:43 pm | Permalink

        Nice pic — I’ve got the same Daisy pellet rifle.

        Excuse me, I must go and obtain ‘release’ whilst perusing Guns’n'Ammo.

        Ohhh….yeah…..

      88. Posted September 4, 2008 at 6:46 pm | Permalink

        That pic is fake, but this one is real…

        …real goofy looking. Look at those crazy eyes.

      89. Posted September 8, 2008 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

        I’m guessing McCain was thinking about the list of all the possible choices and realized they all Palin comparison.

        Honestly, I think Michael Palin would have been a better choice.

      90. Posted September 8, 2008 at 3:59 pm | Permalink

        I just love how she’s a real person. I mean, she eats food! And needs glasses! And can reproduce! It’s amazing!

      91. Robert
        Posted September 8, 2008 at 6:19 pm | Permalink

        Fucking your husband’s business partner…you don’t get much more real than that.

      92. Dave
        Posted September 15, 2008 at 2:06 pm | Permalink

        To everyone who says “How can she possibly be ready to run our country? She’s only done [insert her history here]“:

        Not much huh? Now go look at Barack Hussein Obama’s.

        How in the world could he be ready to lead our country?

        Here he is in a meeting with other world leaders:
        “President Obama, what’s your feeling on the subject?”
        “Present!”

        …it’s nice to have someone who shows for work, but it’s NICER to have someone who actually DOES his work…

      93. Posted September 15, 2008 at 2:27 pm | Permalink

        Dave, your line is getting old. Why is it all the Obama opponents repeat the same lines over and over? Oh wait, the other guys do, too.

        Get educated.

      94. Seth Baker
        Posted September 29, 2008 at 9:07 pm | Permalink

        there are only two real reasons to hunt: hunger and stupidity. Palin’s family does not look malnourished, so that means they are stupid. Oh, wait — i forgot that simplistic views are the sole copyrighted property of the anti-consideration brigade (re: poop-lickin party)! Sorry to step on your clown shoes there, little buddies. I’ll just go back to my long-winded flip-flopping blogs and leave you to your corporate-implanted ideas of how life should be led.

      95. Robert
        Posted November 6, 2008 at 10:47 am | Permalink

        See, dude, I told you Palin was a bad choice. Like I said, McCain was pushed to take her. He had not even met her before. It was the military industrial interests doing the same shit they did in 1980, when they forced Reagan to take CIA man Daddy Bush.

        Palin was just another brain-dead Dubya, but with a pretty face and nice figure.

        She sured up the GOP’s crazy base, but she hurt in every other way.

        I think she did her best to hit the ground running and do her part in that mess called the McCain campaign, but it was an impossible job anyway. It would have been even for a sane, intelligent person.

      96. Posted November 6, 2008 at 11:11 am | Permalink

        Did I ever disagree?

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