Trump’s dangerous campaign to delegitimize the election

Generally speaking, I’m OK with the way things are playing out. I’m happy that, so far, there have been no pro-Trump domestic terrorist attacks. And I like that, despite Trump’s unsubstantiated claims of election fraud, every major news outlet went ahead and called it decisively for Biden. I also like that leaders from around the word have come forward to congratulate Biden on his historic win, even as Donald Trump demanded that, despite all the evidence to the contrary, he’d actually won. I like that some Republicans, like Chris Christie, Mitt Romney, and George W. Bush, have publicly acknowledged the reality of the situation, which is that Trump had been soundly defeated. I like that no one in the legitimate press seems to be taking Trump’s claims, that it was him, and not Biden, who had actually won, seriously. And, of course, I loved the mocking that ensued when Rudy Giuliani spoke on Trump’s behalf outside Philly’s Four Seasons Total Landscaping — right between Fantasy Island Adult Books and Novelties and the Delaware Valley Cremation Center — and attempted, without offering a shred of evidence, to convince the American people that the Democrats had hijacked the election. I loved that Trump has, by and large, been ignored, as Biden has started to actually lead… making announcements about how he intended to spend his first days in office, saying that he intended to getting his COVID task force off the ground, reenter the Paris Climate Accord, etc. I knew that Donald Trump would continue to be a threat to our democracy, but the scorn and ridicule being directed at him every time he claimed to have won, gave me a sense of hope. And I’m still optimistic. At the same time, however, I’m growing more concerned about the steps Trump will take to delegitimize the Biden administration in the eyes of his followers in hopes of further serving his own interests. And I find it alarming that some in government seem intent on going along with him.

There are two things specifically that are concerning me today. First, Attorney General William Barr lent some credibility to the Trump election fraud conspiracy theory earlier today when he issued a memo asking federal prosecutors to investigate what he referred to as “substantial allegations” of voting fraud, saying that this had to happen before the results of the election could be officially certified. [It should be noted that no substantial evidence of widespread fraud has been presented to date. The President and his remaining allies keep talking about voter fraud, but, when asked for examples, they are curiously silent.] And, second, Trump appointee Emily W. Murphy, the administrator of the General Services Administration, is refusing to formally recognize Joe Biden as President-elect, making it impossible for the formal transfer of power to begin. And both of these things are keeping Joe Biden and his administration from the access they need to start preparing for the official transition, putting our national security at risk. So, our country is essentially being held for ransom. The only question is why. Why is Trump refusing to concede? What is it that he’s hoping this will accomplish?

Before we go on, I should mention that the above noted actions on the part of Trump’s people are not going unchallenged. Today, in response to the Barr memo, the Justice Department’s top prosecutor for election crimes, Richard Pilger, announced that he would be stepping down in protest. Furthermore, several individuals working in the two law firms that are overseeing the Trump legal challenges — Jones Day and Porter Wright — have started speaking out. “Six Jones Day lawyers,” the New York Times is reporting today, “said that given the small number of late-arriving ballots involved in the litigation, and the fact that they already had been segregated, the main goal of the litigation seemed to be to erode public confidence in the election…” And they don’t appear to be too thrilled that their firm is participating. And, as you can see here, there’s a campaign afoot to initiate an Inspector General investigation into the previously mentioned Barr memo.

Thankfully, as I said earlier, I don’t get the sense that many people in power — with the exception of some Trump enablers like Lindsey Graham — are investing too heavily in the Trump conspiracy theory about widespread election fraud in the states that he lost. For the most part, it seems to me that they’re following Mitch McConnell’s lead and saying that Trump is “within his rights” to challenge the results, but it doesn’t seem to me that they’re willing to join him in his claim that the election was stolen. But, as you’d expect from people like them, they’re going along for the ride. As one senior Republicans official told the Washington Post today, “What’s the downside of humoring him for this little bit of time? He went golfing this weekend… He’s tweeting about filing some lawsuits; those lawsuits will fail; then he’ll tweet some more about how the election was stolen; then he’ll leave.

It seems to me to be a dangerous game, allowing the President of the United States to tell his followers that the democratic process in our nation isn’t to be trusted, but apparently they don’t give a fuck about that. “What’s the downside?”, they ask.

Just to be clear, the President’s claims have absolutely no merit. When the Republicans fought on the side of Bush against Gore in 2000, they had the best and brightest the GOP had to offer. In this instance, that’s not the case. A few firms are filing challenges on behalf of Giuliani and Trump, but no one believes there’s a chance that Trump will be able to cheat his way into a second term, given the magnitude of the vote deficit he’s facing in multiple states. The person handing the fight for the Trump campaign — David Bossie — isn’t even an attorney. And, as we just learned today, he’s just tested positive for coronavirus.

As for why Trump is pretending to fight it, and telling his people that he’s won, my guess would be that it has to do with money. The Trump campaign is putting out dozens of emails a day, asking their followers to contribute to the court fight over the “stolen election.” The small print, however, makes it clear that a majority of the funds aren’t being used for that purpose at all, but to pay down the debt of the Trump 2020 campaign. He has 30-some percent of the American population in his thrall, and he’s not about to let them go as long as there’s a dollar to be made. And you can bet he’ll be holding rallies, selling Trump 2024 merchandise, launching his own media channel, and doing whatever else he can to ensure that he gets every cent he can from his obedient followers. Or maybe that’s just the threat. Maybe the real goal here is to strengthen his position before going to the Biden administration to make a deal. Whatever his angle, it’s incredibly dangerous, and I wish that more Republicans would have the courage to step up, acknowledge the Biden win, and make it clear to Trump that they’re done with him.

Oh, and just in case anyone really believes that Trump has evidence of election fraud, here’s one more link that might interest you….

update: OK, shit is really getting fucking scary now. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, when asked about working with the Biden transition team, just said, “There will be a smooth transition to a second Trump administration.” This is beyond terrifying, especially when one considers the most recent polling, which shows that 70% of Republicans think the election was rigged, and 38% believe that the results of the election will be overturned and that Donald Trump will serve a second term. This is beyond insane, and I cannot believe that Republicans are saying, “What’s the downside of humoring him for this little bit of time?,” when asked about Trump’s refusal to concede. And fuck anyone who says that Pompeo was “probably joking.”

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129 Comments

  1. John Brown
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 11:18 am | Permalink

    The further he goes, the better chance of a “full Mussolini” for the history blogs. Which is the right lesson for other wannabes, except for all the collateral damage to the rest of us. I prefer to see a dramatic finality to his fate or his toxic followers will plague us long after covid is a quaint memory.

  2. Jean Henry
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 2:13 pm | Permalink

    Pompeo should go to jail for that.
    It’s going to be ok because military brass hate Trump and so do the national guard. They have already defied his orders which was heretofore Unheard of.

    The GOP bigwigs are secretly thrilled he lost according to ppl I know who would know. They won’t let this go on past the point that it’s politically expedient.

    The Georgia runoff means that will take longer than usual. The Trump base loves this.

  3. Jean Henry
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 2:15 pm | Permalink

    A reminder Mark, that you on this site in 2016 and 2017 pushed for an electoral college overthrow to undermine the will of the people as expressed by the election according to the rules.

  4. Bob
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 2:53 pm | Permalink

    They are also rattling Iran’s cage. A tried and true distraction tactic. I’m not as aw shucks about it as you are. At the very least they are preventing the new Covid task force from getting to work at a crucial time period. Deaths. More unnecessary deaths.

  5. Jean Henry
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 3:44 pm | Permalink

    Boa a friend on FB: “I think they’re counting on Republican legislatures to refuse to certify the vote and instead send Trump electors, using BS “fraud” claims as cover. Echoes of the 1876 election and the “1867 compromise” that ended Reconstruction. This time, instead I imagine the compromise they’re hoping for is immunity.”

  6. Posted November 10, 2020 at 3:53 pm | Permalink

    The resignations are a duel edged sword. Esper resigning/fired at defense, has been followed by another chief assistant sec. of defense resigning. As more and more of the top echelons of the Government are filled with “acting” individuals who only have their jobs because they have been politically loyal to Trump, he creates more and more a situation of dual power.
    How far down the chain of command in the DOJ or the DOD do you have to go before you find a person in authority who will stand up to an illegal order. Trump already has a private police in Homeland Security and ICE, which have jurisdiction over much of the country.
    Trump is an old man who may have no choice but to go for broke. The Police create a couple of provocations, the Proud Boys take to the street, and…?

    Currently the rule of law still prevails. This was expected. FF, the law does not allow “self-defense” as a legal defense when you are committing a felony. But law does not matter to the death cult I guess.
    Source: Washington Post

    When Kyle Rittenhouse allegedly shot and killed two people and seriously wounded another man in August during racial justice protests in Kenosha, Wis., he used an assault rifle that authorities said a friend had bought for him.

    At 17, Rittenhouse was too young to have legally bought the Smith & Wesson M & P-15 rifle himself.

    Prosecutors have charged that friend, 19-year-old Dominick David Black, with two felony counts of intentionally selling a gun to a minor. Black made his first court appearance on Monday in the Kenosha County Circuit Court.

    Authorities say Black bought the rifle in April for Rittenhouse, who then allegedly used the gun on Aug. 25 to shoot and kill Joseph Rosenbaum, 36, and Anthony Huber, 26, and to seriously injure Gaige Grosskreutz, 26, during civil unrest sparked by the police shooting of Jacob Blake, a Black Kenosha resident.

  7. Posted November 10, 2020 at 4:02 pm | Permalink

    Just came across some good news I have to share. None of you are old enough to know this guy, but he fucked with my union back in the 80’s –good riddance to another pos.

    https://timesofsandiego.com/life/2020/11/10/tom-metzger-dies-at-82-notorious-kkk-boss-supremacist-who-ran-for-congress/

  8. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    Don’t be an idiot. Undeniable evidence of massive fraud will be coming out shortly. Patriots have it all. Everything I have said is true. Your peeps are going away for a lot of things including treason. American politicians who launder dirty money from foreign countries then coordinate on stealing the vote. It’s beyond shocking but you wonderful folks hate people who don’t love that. Amazing.

  9. Lynne
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

    No HW. That is simply not going to happen. There is no undeniable evidence of massive fraud. There is only a sad old man in the white house tweeting that there is. It is pathetic really.

  10. Frosted Flakes
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 5:41 pm | Permalink

    Under Wisconsin statutes that say anyone under 18 who “goes armed” with any deadly weapon is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor. MISDEMEANOR.

    It’s odd that Wobblie originally claimed Rittenhouse killed people in cold blood. Then video evidence contradicted Wobblies narrative. Now Wobblie is hoping they can convict Rittenhouse on a legal technicality. The only problem for Wobblies argument is that it does not fit the case. Even if it did fit the case, imo it makes no sense to want Rittenhouse found guilty of murder given all that we know.

  11. Nobody
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 6:28 pm | Permalink

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/11/what-if-trump-refuses-concede/616424/

    “The Interregnum allots 35 days for the count and its attendant lawsuits to be resolved. On the 36th day, December 8, an important deadline arrives.

    At this stage, the actual tabulation of the vote becomes less salient to the outcome. That sounds as though it can’t be right, but it is: The combatants, especially Trump, will now shift their attention to the appointment of presidential electors.

    December 8 is known as the “safe harbor” deadline for appointing the 538 men and women who make up the Electoral College. The electors do not meet until six days later, December 14, but each state must appoint them by the safe-harbor date to guarantee that Congress will accept their credentials. The controlling statute says that if “any controversy or contest” remains after that, then Congress will decide which electors, if any, may cast the state’s ballots for president.

    We are accustomed to choosing electors by popular vote, but nothing in the Constitution says it has to be that way. Article II provides that each state shall appoint electors “in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct.” Since the late 19th century, every state has ceded the decision to its voters. Even so, the Supreme Court affirmed in Bush v. Gore that a state “can take back the power to appoint electors.” How and when a state might do so has not been tested for well over a century.

    Trump may test this.”

  12. Lynne
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 6:54 pm | Permalink

    We have to be ready to hit the streets if Trump tries to mess around with the electors. I don’t think he’ll have the support to do it though.

  13. Nobody
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 6:58 pm | Permalink

    Terry Gross interview with the author of the article….

    https://www.npr.org/transcripts/931322781

    Lynne –

    Hitting the streets is exactly what Trump wants. That is when all hell is going to break loose… when the Molon Labe folks will take their cue to start “restoring law and order”. I ( unfortunately )know a few of these people, and as I posted last night.. they are fucking crazy and think they are patriots. They are waiting for their cue.

  14. Posted November 10, 2020 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    The Police will create the necessary provocations. Black people will be out raged at the continuing disregard for black lives. There will be protest, and the Proud Boys will do what that did last summer. That was simply a dress rehearsal for December.

  15. Lynne
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    It is scary to be sure! There are a lot of people who don’t seem to have a grasp on reality. I still have some faith, however, that even Republican legislatures will not appoint electors. I guess we will see but like a lot of folks, I will not really rest easy until Jan 20 even though I still have faith that Americans, in general, will not tolerate a coup.

  16. Posted November 10, 2020 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    FF, Let me tell you a story. Say Kyle went into a party store with his misdemeanor gun violation. The store clerk was taken aback and pulled a gun on what he thought was a thief. Kyle in fear for his life shoots the clerk dead.
    If you think the state will let some one use a “self-defense” defense, in his murder trial–well I am glad you are not an attorney. If anyone working for Kyle is thinking for a moment about his future, they would be trying to get some kind of plea deal.

  17. Frosted Flakes
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 8:30 pm | Permalink

    When someone decides to jaywalk are they simultaneously forfeiting their right to legal self defense—if they are attacked with deadly force as they are in the act of jaywalking?

  18. Jean Henry
    Posted November 10, 2020 at 8:51 pm | Permalink

    Many reputable news outlets saying Pompeo;s comment was a joke. confirmed as such.So fuck me I guess. I don’t actually want him to be serious.I don’t care what his intent was. I hope he walks it back.

    https://www.pix11.com/news/election-2020/do-trumps-denial-of-defeat-and-claims-of-fraud-pose-a-danger-to-democracy-or-national-security

  19. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:01 am | Permalink

    FF, if they are illegally out on the streets in violation of police orders–yes. That would be multiple crimes being committed prior to the jay walking violation and the murder.

  20. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:31 am | Permalink

    HW: “Undeniable evidence of massive fraud will be coming out shortly.“

    Yes, shortly.

    Also, 90% of deaths being attributed to COVID-19 will be revealed as having not been caused by it.

    Tens of thousands of indictments will be unsealed.

    And Trump will be revealed to have been a brilliant, ethical crusader for justice who had been masquerading as a emotionally and intellectually stunted clown all this time.

  21. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:57 am | Permalink

    Here is some bad news. Steve Gray did more to help unemployed folks during a pandemic than probably any other official in the country. Inherited an agency riddiled with corrupt repayment practices, defunded and looted by Republican grifters, and yet still made it work. As always, Democratic politicians throw the best under the bus to appease the unappeasable republican death cult.

    https://www.deadlinedetroit.com/articles/26590/whitmer_sounds_glad_to_see_michigan_unemployment_agency_head_leave?fbclid=IwAR3nkiYNX5Yo-VSJwS6slpZ56yxKU2LMmI-9aZalFB9cHbwiqrrEDhhZxZA

  22. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:02 am | Permalink

    FF, still waiting for the “businessman” who recruited Kyle to “protect” his business to come forward. Mom, is beginning to see where this is all heading.

    https://news.yahoo.com/kenosha-shooters-mother-tries-deflect-172927059.html

  23. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:07 am | Permalink

    the “businessman” is likely to face multiple charges as well. Reckless endangerment, contributing to the delinquency of a minor, perhaps a conspiracy charge or two as well.

  24. Frosted Flakes
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:11 am | Permalink

    Wow.

  25. Frosted Flakes
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:24 am | Permalink

    There are, of course, multiple people that are going to be convicted of minor offenses. But Rittenhouse will not be convicted of murder. Your desire for Rittenhouse to be convicted of murder is bizarre.

    I am still not even sure you have any idea what actually happened….You are trying so hard to misapply laws to a case you don’t understand that you just said that when a person jaywalks they forfeit their right to self defense.

    I am not sure I have time to talk with you about this right now.

  26. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    Here is a pretty good break down of who voted for Biden and who voted for Trump.
    https://thenextrecession.wordpress.com/2020/11/08/us-election-women-the-young-the-working-class-the-cities-and-ethnic-minorities-get-rid-of-trump/?fbclid=IwAR1fZPnaXaTvFo2zPonQ6xKWyqOLdObr6FtCPNu5pRyOQk_znHqJ2F_cha0

    FF, I am in favor of justice. The grifter lawyer who is using Kyle looks like he has raked in a several hundred thousand from the deluded, meanwhile mom only has, $1.25–don’t see the lawyer using that money to post bail for Kyle–wonder why he wants him to stay in jail?

  27. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:52 am | Permalink

    I suspect the mom and lawyer have made the decision that it is better for Kyle to stay in jail. This time in the county lock-up will count as time served, so when they strike the plea deal some time next year, Kyle won’t have to spend quite as much time in prison. Seems like a rational choice to me. What is your theory FF for why the attorney is letting an innocent Kyle continue to languish in jail?

  28. Lynne
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 9:02 am | Permalink

    Wow. Wobblie you got “throw under the bus” from that news story? So much is missing from the story! Maybe he found the stress of the job to be too much and quit? Maybe he was not doing a good job and was asked to resign? Maybe there was some conflict where he wanted to go in one direction but the Governor wanted to go in another? So many possibilities that are all just as likely as that he was asked to resign in order to appease Republicans. (that last part wasn’t in the news story, you just made it up!)

    That Deadline Detroit article seems very irresponsible to me. They are clearly trying to paint a picture of a heartless governor. I guess that is where we are with journalistic integrity these days.

  29. Posted November 11, 2020 at 10:43 am | Permalink

    Lynne, The UI administration has been a play thing for the Republicans for decades. When ever they needed money to balance the budget, raid the UI trust funds–it is there SOP. Whitmer inherited an Agency that had been horribly abused and in some significant ways disassembled. With the onslaught of covid unemployed, Steve did an excellent job getting the agency to respond–there is of course huge amounts of institutional inertia built into government. Whitmer is trying to get the Republicans to back off on the covid obstructionism. They have been using the public dissatisfaction on UI to whip up dissatisfaction with Whitmer–she needed a sacrificial lamb, Steve is a team player. Not hard to read this story accurately.

  30. Jean Henry
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 11:57 am | Permalink

    Apparently many QAnon conspiracy theory subscribers believe that in 11 days after the election, there will be some great reveal of election fraud and Trump and they will be redeemed. So that’s Saturday. I know that these kind of deadlines have come and gone with noe great reveal and the Q nuttiness went on, but I think that Saturday may really put many of the crazy to rest, at least the kind likely to go into the streets looking for vengeance.

    Q hasn’t posted since Election Day as I understand it. They had promised a huge win. Maybe it’s over. That would be a good sign.

  31. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:02 pm | Permalink

    Audit, hand recount in Georgia. Get ready for the President to win handily and massive fraud exposure. The media will say dictator but the evidence will show a Trump blowout in proper legal votes. All kinds of problems for you coming up.

  32. Jean Henry
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:10 pm | Permalink

    HW– IF you are wrong, will you leave this site and never come back?

    You have asserted many things would come to pass which have not.You have laid out a pretty specific prophesy above… again. If its wrong then Q was wrong Q is gone. Please go with him so we can have this forum back.

  33. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:12 pm | Permalink

    Today is 11/11/20. On the Q clock it is the very last day and lines up with the first day, 10/28/1017, a difference of 1111 days.

  34. Jean Henry
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:15 pm | Permalink

    Every state but Texas replied: no evidence of voter fraud.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/10/us/politics/voting-fraud.html

    “Today is 11/11/20. On the Q clock it is the very last day and lines up with the first day, 10/28/1017, a difference of 1111 days.”

    Yes HW, history follows a predictable timeline. Idiocy.

  35. Anonymous
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:18 pm | Permalink

    HW, will you promise that you will never return to this site if your prediction turns out to be wrong and today – this very special day on the “q clock” – does not see evidence of an enormous election fraud operation and Trump’s clear victory?

  36. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

    The best you can say is some things I have said will happen have not happened yet. Much of it has happened just how I said (Mueller, war, economy, elite sex abuse etc.) I think the rest is about to unfold. If it does then I win against all of you plus a little thing called the Entire Fucking Establishment.

  37. Anonymous
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:20 pm | Permalink

    Also, even if it was a joke, I think we deserve a Secretary of State that doesn’t find the threat of dictatorship funny.

  38. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:20 pm | Permalink

    Do you ask a fox to guard your henhouse?

  39. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:28 pm | Permalink

    General Flynn’s top guy promoted. Something to do with the Q plan it seems.

    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/10/trump-loyalists-promoted-to-powerful-pentagon-roles-after-esper-firing.html

    2018 Q post…

    Sep 2 2018 12:24:11 (EST)
    Ezra Cohen-Watnick
    Q

  40. Anonymous
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:29 pm | Permalink

    HW, stop talking in riddles for a minute and answer the question. You said that according to something called the “Q Clock” Biden’s attempt to steal the election would be made public today and we’d all come to know that Trump won fair and square. Is that correct? And if it does not materialize as you have said do you promise never to come back here?

  41. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:56 pm | Permalink

    Pompeo is privy to intelligence about massive election fraud. It’s not a joke. Not in that sense. He knows what is about to happen. It is a truly epic Trump landslide. Your peeps are gonna “go bananas” worse than ever before when they find out. No fraudulent victory: waah waah, break stuff, hurt people.

  42. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 12:57 pm | Permalink

    I said what I said, not what you said.

  43. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 1:15 pm | Permalink

    You need to use quotes when you ascribe statements to me. I find it bizarre you think I said all that. Quite an elaborate projection!

  44. Lynne
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 2:41 pm | Permalink

    I haven’t joined Parler yet but am considering it just to watch all the Trumpers when it finally sinks in that Trump has lost this election.

    http://loser.com

  45. Posted November 11, 2020 at 4:41 pm | Permalink

    Go get your $1,000,000, HW!

    Texas Lt. Gov Dan Patrick offers up to $1 million for information on ‘voter fraud’

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/11/11/texas-lt-gov-offers-up-1-million-information-voter-fraud/6246466002/

    (From USA Today)

    #crackpot

  46. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 5:53 pm | Permalink

    Oops

    https://www.newsmax.com/newsmax-tv/trey-trainor-fec-trump-2020-election/2020/11/06/id/995772/

    Chair of the Federal Election Commission Trey Trainor believes voter fraud is taking place in states still counting ballots…

  47. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 5:54 pm | Permalink

    Why is it sooo fuckin’ easy?

  48. Posted November 11, 2020 at 6:24 pm | Permalink

    Not letting lunatics like yourself harass the election workers does not constitute election fraud. Legitimate observers are being permitted to be close to the tabulation activities. Lunatic freaks like yourself are not being tolerated in these places. You have emotional and mental problems. You’re wrong over and over and somehow are incapable of learning from the experiences.

  49. Posted November 11, 2020 at 6:33 pm | Permalink

    Trainor said ballot watchers “have not been allowed into the polling locations in a meaningful way.”

    “in a meaningful way.” Why do think he states it that way, stupid?

    “Trainor said locations not granting observers access to watch the ballot counting process could be involved in voter fraud.”

    COULD be! COULD be, moron. There’s a reason he does not say ARE.

  50. Posted November 11, 2020 at 6:36 pm | Permalink

    By the way, Turnip, why do you suppose the Chair of the Federal Election Commission isn’t there observing all this fraud himself, in person. Is he too busy to be right there? You’re a fucking idiot, HW.

  51. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:08 pm | Permalink

    Proper observers were kept out in Michigan and Pennsylvania. There is video of it happening in Philly to one with a license from the city. Fuck you. You lie.

  52. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:29 pm | Permalink

    Some individuals were refused admission because the maximum limit of permitted observers in the building had been exceeded. A number of observers were removed because they violated rules of conduct. These people were not permitted back in either. Judges have been hearing these charges and dismissing them because the statements are misleading. Observers have been present and observing the counting. But the accusations are actually that specific wannabe observers were not permitted. But in the media the accusations are being stated so as to give the impression GOP observers were not permitted at all. That’s a lie, and you are being suckered…as usual.

  53. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:34 pm | Permalink

    The Chair of the Federal Election Commission has chosen not to personally observe any of what is going on in the counting center. If he felt such a monumental event as the stealing of a presidential election were in process, he obviously would be there in person to coordinate his lawyers and observers on the scene. There is no reason not to be there, except that he knows this is all bullshit rhetoric he is spewing.

  54. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:39 pm | Permalink

    Only Trump’s sycophant appointees are pushing his bullshit. They’re sucking up to their emotionally and mentally stunted boss. That’s all that’s happening. They even smile when they do it so as to appear that is all okay somehow. It’s pathetic and demented.

    Did you make a big donation to the legal fund? You should. You should give everything you have. It’s that important.

  55. Lynne
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:43 pm | Permalink

    They have to keep the base up in arms for as long as possible in order to fleece more money from them. I assume you have been donating to the Trump election fraud fund like a good little patriot, eh HW/.

  56. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:51 pm | Permalink

    That’s ridiculous. In Detroit they counted at Cobo and there was barely anyone per square foot. There was no reasonable maximum number met. You are wrong about all this. Watch what happens. You’ll admit you are my bitch if I am correct, right?

  57. Posted November 11, 2020 at 7:59 pm | Permalink

    I know you won’t admit it. You never do. You’re just like those freaks that keep resetting the date for their rapture. You’re a cultist freak.

    How’d that Hunter laptop thing turn out for you? You said it was going destroy Joe. Remember?

  58. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:06 pm | Permalink

    It did destroy what was left of him. He got blown out in the real election. That will be born out by the audits and recounts.

  59. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:09 pm | Permalink

    The story fizzled. You can’t even admit it. Pathetic.

  60. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:10 pm | Permalink

    Nearly 80% of Americans say Biden won White House, ignoring Trump’s refusal to concede – Reuters/Ipsos poll

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-election-poll/nearly-80-of-americans-say-biden-won-white-house-ignoring-trumps-refusal-to-concede-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUKKBN27Q3DW?il=0

  61. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:13 pm | Permalink

    Too bad it’s the votes that count, not a bunch of dorks’ opinions.

  62. Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:22 pm | Permalink

    Yes, too bad for you.

    Too bad you don’t comprehend the simple facts. 101 million early votes were cast. Democrats encouraged voters to vote early and by mail. Trump discouraged it. As a result Democrats votes almost 2-1 over Republicans.

  63. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:23 pm | Permalink

    Youtube is down. Major outages all over. If it all goes down and the emergency alert system is activated then know that Q told the world years ago it will happen. “Ten days of darkness”

  64. Lynne
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 8:32 pm | Permalink

    Here is an interesting election tidbit and one I didn’t expect. White men were one of the groups that shifted in favor of Biden but white *women* shifted in favor of Trump. I have no idea why. Anyhow, looking at all of that exit polling data has me convinced that had the candidate I voted for in the primaries won (Warren), she would have likely lost the general election. I just hope that seeing a woman in the role of VP will convince more white ladies that women can lead and they don’t have to keep voting for white supremacy and patriarchy.

  65. Another Mark
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 11:31 pm | Permalink

    youtube is back up, lights are on, etc. Still waiting on those sealed indictments, we’re at COB on day 1111 and nothing has made it different than day 1110, etc. If nothing changes by saturday (trump tweeting doesn’t count as a thing), will you finally admit doubt HW?

    I’m not too worried yet about the administrations lawsuits or behavior since the loss (outside of the whole whiny unamericanness of it). Hell, if they want to count the votes again by all means do it, as long as they count every legal ballot as defined by the state on election day. Shoot, you can even stop counting/reject the extended mail in ballots in states where it was court ordered. It doesn’t change anything, Biden won, and will win again no matter how many times you count them.

  66. Another Mark
    Posted November 11, 2020 at 11:58 pm | Permalink

    I also find in amusing that the batshit wing of the batshit party is alleging fraud in places where Trump actually improved on his vote share. If Democrats were cheating in Detroit and Phili, then they kind of suck at it. Trump lost this election by underperforming in the suburbs and underperforming relative to rest of his party. If dems were cheating, you wouldn’t expect the house/senate republicans performing well and Trump losing, unless the dems forgot about the house/senate race (oh my god they kind of did though didn’t they?).

    I’d be curious on hot takes on the downballot races. Why did the dems suck? Are they too progressive, not progressive enough? I tend to think letting activists frame police reform as defunding the police was dumb. If you want police reform, step 1) invest in policing. I also think the progressive wing of the party needs to find some candidates that can win in the midwest in statewide elections. Basically, a bunch of less creepy Al Frankens, that are not exactly in the AOC wing of the party, but are pushing progressive policies. Right now there is just too much of a mismatch in the party between its most urban districts, and in all the other places that Democrats exist too.

  67. Posted November 12, 2020 at 5:14 am | Permalink

    In poll watcher affidavits, Trump campaign offers no evidence of fraud in Detroit ballot-counting

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/michigan–poll-watcher-affidavits/2020/11/11/4d073d7a-2447-11eb-a688-5298ad5d580a_story.html

  68. Max
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 8:23 am | Permalink

    “He got blown out in the real election.” Biden has more than five million more votes than Trump, a three point spread. It’s not even close. I hope the GOP blows their war chest on all this litigation and can’t spend what it needs to in GA to win the Senate run offs.

  69. Bob
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 8:29 am | Permalink

    Does Q have a team to do wellness checks on it’s cult members? Somebody make sure John Barr jr doesn’t have his head in the oven.

  70. John Galt
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 8:57 am | Permalink

    Is the storm here yet? According to my Q Clock, yesterday was the big day! Does anyone have photos of Hillary Clinton being frogmarched into prison? I’ve been looking for the media coverage, but cannot find it. Also, did the “legitimate” ballots prove definitively that Trump had won? I have a bottle of champaign that needs popping!

  71. wobblie
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 9:06 am | Permalink

    John you are using the Gregorian calendar. Q relies upon the Julian calendar. Perpetually behind the times.

  72. Bob
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    Is champaign a libation used for celebrating in Illinois? I think all those dead people there who voted Biden in are drinking it. Mayor Richard Daley is still delivering for the Dems!

  73. Anonymous
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:01 pm | Permalink

    The money donated to the “recount” effort will be diverted to the DJT legal fund to keep him out of jail or fines. Just like the Bannon build the wall fund. Grifters always be grifting.

  74. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:09 pm | Permalink

    He has the evidence. Military intelligence got it in real time on election night. It will be made public and you will be majorly fucked. It’s extremely obvious. All assets are being deployed to rig it for Biden. Too bad it’s a bit more difficult to pull it off now for some reason.

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1326926226888544256

  75. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:13 pm | Permalink

    The most topical freudian slip on the web today. There might be a close second in the same breath.

    https://twitter.com/theangiestanton/status/1326284622381129729

  76. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:18 pm | Permalink

    Is Dominion Voting Systems alright do you think? Clinton/Pelosi/etc. connected? True or false? For starters.

  77. Anonymous
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-reportedly-very-aware-lost-143004283.html

    Keep up the donations!

  78. Bob
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:49 pm | Permalink

    Fucking deranged

  79. Posted November 12, 2020 at 12:59 pm | Permalink

    No, Dominion voting machines did not cause widespread problems

    https://www.chicagotribune.com/election-2020/ct-nw-nyt-dominion-voting-machines-problems-20201112-dfhvga5uzjatdah2azb3fytlaa-story.html

  80. Posted November 12, 2020 at 1:02 pm | Permalink

    Posts falsify ties between election tech firm and Democrats

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/posts-falsify-ties-between-election-tech-firm-and-democrats/2020/11/10/f112591e-239c-11eb-9c4a-0dc6242c4814_story.html

  81. Posted November 12, 2020 at 1:12 pm | Permalink

    Beatin’ that ass. This is too easy.

  82. Ypsilanti Truther
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 1:38 pm | Permalink

    John Barr, Sr.,

    Sir, according to my Q Calendar, it’s time for you to come and pick you your son. We’ve enjoyed our time with him, but the play date has to end.

    Thank you,
    The same people of Ypsilanti

  83. Jean Henry
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 4:03 pm | Permalink

    I am hoping HW gets raptured up up and away from this site on this, the Q day of reckoning— one way or another.

  84. Anonymous
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 7:10 pm | Permalink

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/life-after-q-anon-trumps-loss-allows-some-to-escape-conspiracy-cults-grip-182003557.html

    I’m still hoping that Ypsilanti will be sending delegates to the Million MAGA March.

  85. Jean Henry
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 8:25 pm | Permalink

    Maybe EOS is hanging out here these days…

    https://www.reddit.com/r/QAnonCasualties/

  86. Jean Henry
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 10:22 pm | Permalink

    Probably watching Newsmax though now that Fox has betrayed his royal ornateness. https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/12/media/fox-news-newsmax-reliable-sources/index.html

  87. Jean Henry
    Posted November 12, 2020 at 10:23 pm | Permalink

    orangeness*

  88. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 5:57 am | Permalink

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-reportedly-trying-survive-1-064159517.html

    He has good company here.

  89. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 6:02 am | Permalink

    https://theweek.com/articles/948463/trump-ever-unpopular-thought

    And here.

  90. Posted November 13, 2020 at 7:16 am | Permalink

    EOS has moved to Georgia. Good article on how the left elected Biden here in Michigan. JH, maybe you can track down an article about how well the Biden ground game was here in Michigan.

    https://www.jacobinmag.com/2020/11/trump-michigan-election-biden-rashida-tlaib?fbclid=IwAR1M3jtzt3DX9cJGAncHsZhI1CsldyXxJOu0YVqSjL2xQ_8CljnVQSdLekw

  91. Lynne
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 8:19 am | Permalink

    It never ceases to amaze me the absolute bullshit Wobblie believes!

    Bernie Sanders would not have won. He proved in the primary that he simply cannot bring the votes. And it was a collective effort in Michigan.

  92. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 8:51 am | Permalink

    The Left includes grassroots movements for social justice and BLM, Wobblie. The movement for racial Justice united the left. It didn’t fracture it as many here said it would. And the racist white working class vote is permanently sheared from the Dem party. We will never hear again how we need to appeal to them; we can continue to serve their needs with good policy for all.

    The GOTV effort here was impressive. Jacobin is a terrible site. So annoying.

  93. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 8:58 am | Permalink

    David Sirota is now editor in chief of Jacobin so everything now will be tinged with his Bernie could have won spin. He’s a hack, albeit one with an audience eager to have their narrative bias confirmed. .

  94. John Brown
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 10:15 am | Permalink

    Meanwhile, in the Bering Sea, Russia acts completely unchecked with aggression towards US fishing vessels within our exclusive economic zone. What kind of worthless ruskie stooge traitor fails to protect sovereign US territorial rights against pootin? What a POS GOP loser!

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/12/us/russia-military-alaska-arctic-fishing.html

    Recall John Brown warning about the ruskies angling for an opening to advance their strategic grip on the melting Arctic. Well here it is on full display with no US response at all. Pitiful. Weakness personified.

  95. Demetrius
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 10:32 am | Permalink

    Just as in 2016, Jean’s post-election prescription is to double-down on identity politics, and (finally) give the heave-ho to those deplorable white voters.

    Just as in 2016, her interpretation of a narrow election outcome is that it is a mandate to re-shape the Democratic Party based on faulty logic.

    Yes – the country is rapidly becoming more diverse, and the share of white voters continues to decline. Still, white voters still made up more than 65% of the electorate in 2020, and will remain an essential must-win constituency for at least the next couple of decades. Moreover, a greater percentage of white voters picked Biden in 2020 than chose Clinton in 2016. Curiously, Trump also got a higher (though still modest) share of Black and Latino votes than in 2016, or in previous elections.

    While Biden won, his margin in many swing states was (is) alarmingly small. And, contrary to many predictions, Democrats actually lost House seats, and failed to take the Senate. Realistically, 2020 wasn’t any kind of landslide, and certainly not the mandate that Jean seems to be suggesting.

    I’m grateful (and relieved) that Biden won – but also *very* aware of just how close we came to having Trump II – along with the possibility of suffering a Republican Senate and a significantly reduced Democratic House majority.

    I think the real lesson here is the Democrats need to wake up and begin planning now for 2022 and 2024 – starting with doing some serious leadership house-cleaning (Schumer, Pelosi, Durbin … etc.), and by developing and actively promoting a serious “kitchen table” agenda that will appeal to ALL types of voters in ALL parts of the country – mainly, real jobs that pay real wages, universal healthcare, education for the 21st -not 19th – century, massive investments in infrastructure including green energy, etc.

    Instead, I’m afraid many Democrats are so busy celebrating Biden’s win that they see it as a vindication of the same tired DNC strategy … ignoring the bigger picture, and likely to end up woefully unprepared (again) next time.

  96. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 10:36 am | Permalink

    Jacobin is good, actually

  97. Bob
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 11:03 am | Permalink

    Bernie Sanders has never done anything except motivate people to vote, help elect young candidates (primarily women), push racial and gender equality, work towards green issues, support civil rights when it was legitimately dangerous, be virtually the only senator who isn’t bought and sold for years, shift the party measurably back towards it’s actual democratic values, bow out gracefully even when fucked by the DNC, support the establishment candidates, and be remarkably consistent in everything he’s said for fifty years. And still you bitter Hillary trolls bad-mouth him. Because he had the audacity to run against the chosen one.
    Will you shit talk AOC when she runs for president and continues with Bernie’s message? Will she be too progressive, populist, left and unelectable, or will you two suddenly be onboard because she’s got lady parts?

  98. Posted November 13, 2020 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    Every Democrat who ran for the House and campaigned on Medicare for All, WON. Every Democrat who ran against Medicare for All lost. Every Democrat who ran for the House on a Green New Deal, WON, every Democrat who ran for the House and said no to a Green New Deal lost.
    The Republicans (just like with Obama) framed the election as needing to STOP SOCIALISM. The Republicans lost the Presidency just like with Obama. I know I am slow witted, but some people are mule like, and never learn.

  99. Another Mark
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 2:29 pm | Permalink

    lol, every democrat who opposes Medicare/GND for all in the house did not lose. Nancy Pelosi doesn’t support either and she’ll continue serving as speaker. Just because you had the thought doesn’t make it true.

  100. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

    Bernie Sander circa the ‘20 election was indeed much improved over the 2016 version. It took hi 30 years but he figured out how to listen to others.

    In 2016 he didn’t even support down ticket progressives in their races in the primary when it counted. He did not have a diverse coalition and saw it as unnecessary. 2018 showed the what his movement got right and got wrong. It can no longer be called his movement and thank god.

    Good for him for changing. He was never deserving of the idolatry however. There are better candidates.

    I will be grateful to Bernie for the same reason I supported his candidacy in the first months in the beginning: because he brought the issues forward that many many other people had been talking about and working on for ages. I’m glad he figured out how to engage those ppl eventually.

    None of that means he would have won the general or that David Sirota isn’t a hired hack. Sirota was pushed the Biden dementia narrative hard even when it was clear he would be the nominee. Gross.

  101. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

    Other Mark: there’s a meme going around that they copped that from… it’s everywhere because ideologues need to believe. They believe more than they’ll ever know. It’s a lovely quality until someone dares counter their narrative with political reality. Then they go all Wolfpack mentality and call you an enemy of progress. Then suddenly their good hearts go decidedly blacker.

    I have said here before multiple times that far left or right candidates winning in a packed house district does not translate to winning in the general. Duh.

    Go ahead shoot the messenger of the totally obvious.

  102. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 2:50 pm | Permalink

    Demetrius— what part of centering the most marginalized and committed Dem voters says give the heave ho to white voters.

    Ps a lot of Trump supporters are deplorable. The Dem policies will still serve them better than Trump’s. If they are so full of hate and fear towards people not like them that they vote against there own self interests them fuck them.

    Anonymous— Jacobin may offer a necessary perspective but it’s severely bent towards its ideology. I guess that’s what passes for journalism these days. I think it’s a loss. It gets clicks and you have to credit Jacobin for working the hustle needed to stay afloat in the current market. That’s a lot of game for anti capitalists.

    At any rate, I think Sirota is a political operative not a committed socialist. Everything I’ve seen from him indicates a dangerous Machiavellian streak.

  103. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 3:17 pm | Permalink

    “It gets clicks and you have to credit Jacobin for working the hustle needed to stay afloat in the current market. That’s a lot of game for anti capitalists.”

    https://thenib.com/mister-gotcha/

  104. Demetrius
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    Maybe … this?

    “And the racist white working class vote is permanently sheared from the Dem party. We will never hear again how we need to appeal to them …”

  105. Posted November 13, 2020 at 5:16 pm | Permalink

    Do a simple search on Nancy Pelosis and Medicare for All or Green New Deal. Not a single article appears with a 2020 dateline. She did not campaign against the ideas. The one article that does appear with a 2020 dateline on Green New Deal, says she is holding the covid relieve package hostage to passage of the Green New Deal. She knows what the people want and expect. Will she deliver?
    JH’s tactics always is to shoot the messenger, and then dismiss the arguments presented as “marginal” or “ideological” without acknowledging that they are over whelming popular–and absolutely necessary.
    Biden will go Bold if the People Demand Boldness.
    Years ago when I worked in the political arm of the UAW, we had a simple formula, if you can solve the problem with money–solve the problem, it is better to do some thing than nothing.

  106. Lynne
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 6:44 pm | Permalink

    I do like AOC and not just for her lady-parts although that is part of it in that I think representation matters. I like her policies. Just like I liked Bernie Sanders’s policies when I voted for him in 2016. Bernie lost me when he was a dick to HRC and allowed his supporters to be dicks to Hillary supporters. I think he has been a valuable voice in Washington though. I wish he could have brought the votes in 2020 even. I was honestly equally fine with him and with Biden which is one of the reasons I voted for Warren even though she had already dropped out. I wondered. Will that political revolution happen? Will all those progressives turn out? Turns out, Nope!

    As for identity politics, Democrats have not won a single presidential race in 50 years with the white vote. White people as a group vote conservative. So maybe it is time for the Democrats to make damn sure that what they do serves POC. The good news there is that the programs likely to serve POC the most are also likely to improve things for a lot of white people. As white people become less racist (and I see that happening), they may decide to vote in ways that improve their lives?

    I want to see a Democratic party leadership that is changed and that is much more representative of the party base.

    I also love the Green New Deal. I love it. I want that to be part of how we address climate change. I want Medicare 4 All or a public option as part of the ACA. I see a public option as part of the ACA as a step towards Medicare 4 All or something like it. As an armchair economist, I know that a public option is going to be more efficient. It will be on that ACA marketplace offering better coverage at a cheaper price. Do I care if some folks are so anti-socialism that they might want to spend more money on inferior coverage? Not really.

  107. Posted November 13, 2020 at 8:12 pm | Permalink

    The number of US COVID-19 deaths has crossed the quarter-million mark. Trump is now showing absolutely no interest in doing anything about it.

  108. Demetrius
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 8:20 pm | Permalink

    @ Lynne

    “The good news there is that the programs likely to serve POC the most are also likely to improve things for a lot of white people.”

    I couldn’t agree more. Underneath all our apparent differences, I think most people actually want many of the same things – an opportunity to have job with dignity that pays a living wage, a chance to get a solid education, access to quality healthcare if/when sick, a healthy environment, peace, justice, and perhaps the chance to own a home, and to someday have a secure retirement.

    If Democrats can find a way to get “back to basics” and can begin actively promoting (and better yet, delivering on) some of these core principles, I think they could put together a powerful coalition that would be capable of winning landslides for years to come.

    On the other hand, if they stick with their current “calculus” of trying to reach 50%+1 in each and every election by somehow attracting “Black Women + Suburban White Women + older Gay Men + Left-handed academics in their mid-40’s … ” I fear they are destined to continue experiencing repeated, very narrow election victories/losses, and consequently – will fail to achieve an electoral majority that’s required to accomplish substantial policy goals.

  109. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 9:17 pm | Permalink

    It’s odd how some states voted for Biden but posted Republican gains otherwise. Could it be that Trump turned off enough of his own party to cause them to split the ticket? I think so, and if that’s the case the Democrats have to refocus on health care, education, and good employment prospects for the average American, meaning those without a college degree. They can’t run on being not Trumpian.

  110. Lynne
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 9:32 pm | Permalink

    Demetrius, if they are attracting those voting blocs by giving them more leadership positions and by supporting laws that protect their civil rights, I am all for it! What do you think “identity politics” is? It is almost always about groups fighting for equality. I am 100% in favor of that.

    We have to both make things better economically for those without a college degree AND make college more affordable and accessible so more people can continue their education.

  111. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

    Biden’s climate plan was negotiated with AOC and the Sunrise youth climate action movement leaders. And he’s still taking shit from the left for it. I doubt they’ve even looked at it.

  112. Jean Henry
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 9:47 pm | Permalink

    Demetrius what does an appeal to the WWC entail? It’s not serving them. It’s indulging their xenophobia and racism. We already serve them better than the right.

    There is nothing that needs to be done for the white working class that is exclusive to them v the whole working class. Appealing to the WWC requires absorbing their narrative— particularly that identity politics is problematic to unity.

    What a load of hogwash.

  113. Anonymous
    Posted November 13, 2020 at 10:53 pm | Permalink

    https://www.vox.com/2018/5/8/17308744/bullshit-jobs-book-david-graeber-occupy-wall-street-karl-marx

    I think the pandemic really showed this.

  114. Posted November 14, 2020 at 6:42 am | Permalink

    JH, please support your baseless accusations that , “Biden’s climate plan was negotiated with AOC and the Sunrise youth climate action movement leaders. And he’s still taking shit from the left for it. I doubt they’ve even looked at it.” Which people on the left are giving Biden shit for his climate action plan. I guess smart folks know there statements are taken as truth and have no need to substantiate them.
    I don’t know of any “leftist” who is criticizing Biden’s public support for climate action. Are there many people who believe we need to move bolder and quicker, yes. Unlike the stick my head in the sand and hope for gradual change moderates, thoughtful smart folks know action is needed now.
    Like with the trumpvirus, supporting smart public health initiatives, while at the same time advocating bold and decisive action is “not giving some one shit”, it is generating support for the minimal actions Biden is proposing while building support for better actions in the future. The minimalist do nothing moderates are simply death cultist without the trappings.

  115. Posted November 14, 2020 at 6:49 am | Permalink

    Maybe some folks might be interested. Internationalism at work.

    https://cop26coalition.org/global-gathering-programme/

  116. Jean Henry
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 8:00 am | Permalink

    Wobblie— I see Biden’s climate agenda dismissed all the time on grounds of it not being exactly the Green New Deal and especially re no fracking ban/ just strict regulations. I’m surprised you aren’t railing against it honestly. That’s great. So compromise and incremental change is ok if AOC agrees to it?

  117. Lynne
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 9:05 am | Permalink

    Wobblie, see https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/aoc-joins-biden-s-climate-policy-panel-n1205886

    AOC is on board! That is one of the things that has impressed me about Biden. He is very inclusive and brings in people from all areas of the party.

  118. Posted November 14, 2020 at 9:20 am | Permalink

    You know I am a pretty simple guy. My daddy taught me very early, if you don’t ask you don’t get. Being critical and pointing out the need for greater speed and more deliberate and effective action is not the same as being opposed to getting something done. I am not a satisfied person. I want a better future, and I want to start making it happen now.
    Whitmer stopping the pipeline is good. Fracking is dead, only folks who are still making or hoping to make money off fossil fuels think other wise. Our zombie economy built on fossil fuels, requiring our endless interventions in other fossil fuel nations, is over. It is all about how it ends, dragged out with additional wars, destitution and impoverishment, or having a fixed idea for a better world that we are going to build now. You say you believe the scientist (except where it might force you to change?)
    I am going to keep asking for better politicians, better policies, more equity, more of all the good things in life for all of us, NOW. Fuck incrementalism, you are still waiting for equal rights, and it has been your whole life as a second class person. Does it not IRK you? How have you grown so used to and tolerant of your condition in life? Seems un-American to me.
    Oh well, I am sure now that Trump is on the way out everything will be hunkie dorrie like during the Obama years.

  119. Bob
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 9:26 am | Permalink

    Watching Jean find ways to passively aggressively knock AOC in the coming years without tipping into mouth-foaming hysteria is going to be a real joy. Oh the typos we’ll share.

  120. Anonymous
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 9:51 am | Permalink

    Can we get a million MAGA update from FF please?

  121. Anonymous
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 10:07 am | Permalink

    Climate Chaos (Part I): How the Gap Between Liberal Rhetoric & Policy Promotes Denialism:
    https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/episode-121-climate-chaos-part-i-how-the-gap-between-liberal-rhetoric-policy-promotes-denialism

    Climate Chaos (Part II)  - The Militarization of Liberals’ Climate Change Response:
    https://citationsneeded.libsyn.com/episode-122-climate-chaos-part-ii-the-militarization-of-liberals-climate-change-response

  122. Demetrius
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 11:16 am | Permalink

    Politico: How 2020 Killed Off Democrats’ Demographic Hopes

    “Demographics are not destiny, says David Shor. And if Democrats want their party to succeed nationally, they’ll have to face that fact and change. Here’s how.

    For years, the Democratic Party has operated under one immutable assumption: Long-term demographic trends would give the party something like a permanent majority as the country as a whole grows less white and more urban. President Donald Trump’s reliance on the politics of racial resentment would only quicken the process, solidifying support for Democrats among people of color.

    Then came November 3, 2020. And all those assumptions now seem like total nonsense.

    “The joke is that the GOP is really assembling the multiracial working-class coalition that the left has always dreamed of,” says David Shor, a Democratic polling and data expert who developed the Obama 2012 campaign’s internal election-forecasting system.

    Trump, whose approval rating was historically low throughout his tenure as president, increased his support among Black men and Hispanic voters in key swing states, while maintaining his hold on white non-college educated voters. Democrats’ House majority shrank, thanks in part to losses in the suburbs, and split-ticket voting all but disappeared, dooming Democratic Senate candidates in rural, Trump-friendly states. And even while President-Elect Joe Biden is on track to win a higher share of the national popular vote than anyone challenging an incumbent president since Franklin D. Roosevelt, the future for Democrats now looks, well, bleak.

    “We have an election system that makes it basically impossible for Democrats’ current coalition to ever wield legislative power,” says Shor. “We are legitimately in a position from here on out where we would need to get 54 percent of the popular vote — which we did not even accomplish this time — for multiple cycles in a row, for us to be in a position to really pass laws.”

    https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/11/12/2020-election-analysis-democrats-future-david-shor-interview-436334

  123. Jean Henry
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 8:43 pm | Permalink

    BOB– I fucking love AOC. You really don’t get it at all. Whatever.

  124. Jean Henry
    Posted November 14, 2020 at 8:49 pm | Permalink

    Redistricting reform is critical, Demetrius. It can protect control of the house and correct the imbalances in state legislatures.

    As I have said here many times, having both parties compete for the votes of Black, Brown and Gay voters can only improve both parties and the country as a whole. I do not see that as a bad thing at all. Dems took voters of color for granted. Stupid.

    Still Dems get a much larger majority of those votes than white votes. If it was up to the White population this country would be solid red.

  125. Posted November 15, 2020 at 7:04 am | Permalink

    JH, you still refuse to address how having both parties compete for the votes of Black, Brown and Gay voters can only improve both parties and the country as a whole, is not a worthwhile and viable strategy for working class voters of all colors.

  126. Demetrius
    Posted November 15, 2020 at 9:28 am | Permalink

    NYT: There Was No Knockout, So Democrats and G.O.P. Regroup for Next Round

    Voters delivered a convincing victory for Joseph R. Biden Jr. but a split decision for the two parties. Now they face perhaps the most up-for-grabs electoral map the country has seen in a generation.

    ” …With 306 electoral college votes and the most popular votes of any presidential candidate in history, Mr. Biden attained a victory that was paramount to many Democrats, who saw a second Trump term as nothing less than a threat to democracy.

    Yet on the electoral landscape, both parties find themselves stretched thin and battling on new fronts, with their traditional strongholds increasingly under siege. Indeed, Democrats and Republicans are facing perhaps the most unsettled and up-for-grabs electoral map the country has seen in a generation, since the parties were still fighting over California in the late 1980s.

    This competition has denied either from being able to claim broad majorities and prompted a series of election cycles, which could be repeated in 2022, in which any gains Democrats make in the country’s booming cities and states are at least partly offset by growing Republican strength in rural areas.

    The election represented a continuation of this trench warfare between two parties that are increasingly defined by their activist flanks and limited to only incremental advances. …”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/15/us/politics/2020-election-recap-democrats-republicans.html

  127. Lynne
    Posted November 15, 2020 at 10:49 am | Permalink

    Wobblie, the more POC are in the GOP, the less they can use white supremacy to influence their platform. That is how it will improve our country as a whole. No, it will likely not help working-class people but hopefully, if the GOP stops appealing to the racism of the white working class, they will start uniting with the non-white working class as a voting bloc! That is how it might benefit Democrats.

  128. Demetrius
    Posted November 16, 2020 at 3:33 pm | Permalink

    NYT: Liberals Envisioned a Multiracial Coalition. Voters of Color Had Other Ideas.

    Democrats may need to rethink their strategy as the class complexities and competing desires of Latino and Asian-American demographic groups become clear.

    ” … The (2020) results suggest that Democrats may need to adjust their strategy as the complexities of class, generation and experience, and the competing desires of these demographic groups become clear. Since the dawn of the 21st century, it has become commonplace for party leaders to talk of a rising demographic tide that is destined to lift the Democrats to dominance. That liberal coalition is seen as resting on a bedrock of upper-middle-class white voters, alongside working- and middle-class Black, Latino and Asian voters. …

    … Aside from those successes, however, the election presented complications wrapped one inside another for Democrats. In Texas and Florida, in California and in Colorado (where New York Times exit polls found that roughly 40 percent of white voters and 38 percent of Latino voters cast ballots for President Trump), the assumption that people of color would vote as a liberal Democratic bloc often proved illusory. …”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/16/us/liberals-race.html

  129. Lynne
    Posted November 17, 2020 at 9:41 am | Permalink

    I see Biden has named Lisa Cook to his transition team. I hope that means we can expect to see her as part of his administration! I am liking Biden more and more all of the time.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisa_D._Cook

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