They want to bankrupt the blue states, and kill public unions, but, yes, let’s talk about the injection of Lysol

Toward the end of this past week, it became evident that the Republicans intended to use this horrific pandemic in order to force individual states into bankruptcy. Mitch McConnell, having worked to deliver hundreds of millions of our hard-earned tax dollars to corporations, said this past Wednesday that the states being hit hardest by COVID-19 would not be getting the same kind of bailout from the government. “We’re not interested in solving their pension problems for them,” the Senate Majority leader said, alluding to the financial crisis looming in America’s largest, most prosperous states, like California and New York. McConnell added that he was, “in favor of allowing states to use the bankruptcy route.” This attitude of McConnell’s, as New York Governor Andrew Cuomo said just afterward, is “offensive,” “vicious,” “ugly,” and “reckless.” It’s also not terribly surprising.

If the Democrats held the White House and Senate, I’m sure, right now, we’d be talking about the possibility of instituting something like the Green New Deal, that might accomplish the dual positive results of putting people back to work, while, at the same time, finally putting our nation on the path to addressing global climate change in a significant and meaningful way. It’s deep in the DNA of politics to — in the words of Ram Emanuel — ensure that crises like this don’t “go to waste.” FDR used the great depression to give us the New Deal. The lesser Bush used the 9/11 attack to take us to war in Iraq. And, now, it looks as though the Republicans are using the coronavirus pandemic to once again raid the treasury on behalf of corporate America, shrink government and break public unions. And that’s exactly what this is about. When McConnell says, as he did a few days ago, that he doesn’t want the “federal government to borrow money from future generations” to bail he states out, when they could just go bankrupt instead, he’s not being sincere. If he were, he would have said the same thing when the airlines and cruise ship operators came asking for their bailouts, and when his own party chose to explode the deficit in order to paper over the failings of the Trump economy. The truth is, the want blue states to go bankrupt because they hate government, and want strong unions, like the teachers’ unions, to collapse.

And that’s what I wanted to write about today. I wanted to write about the longstanding Republican plan to destroy government and kill unions. But then Donald Trump came along and said that our scientists should look into ways to get light and disinfectants into the human body to kill COVID-19, and now I feel as though I need to at acknowledge it, seeing as how there are apparently people who, inspired by his remarks, are thinking about shooting-up Lysol… Here, before we get into it, is Trump extolling the possible virtues of introducing bleach and sunlight into the human body. This, by the way, is the best camera angle from the Trump press conference, as it captures the face of White House infectious disease advisor Deborah Birx when Donald Trump appears to sanction the possible use of bleach within the human body.

Trump, for what it’s worth, claimed yesterday that he was being “sarcastic” when he said what he did about finding ways to get sunlight and disinfectants into the body. “I was asking a question sarcastically to reporters like you, just to see what would happen,” Trump said. That’s not what happened, though.

When Donald Trump said what he did, he was being serious. It’s evident from both the video and the transcript. He was attempting to sound as though he has a handle on this incredibly serious situation we now find ourselves in, and he got in over his head. He’d just heard Bill Bryan, the head of the Science and Technology Directorate at the Department of Homeland Security, talking about research being done at the National Biodefense Analysis and Countermeasures Center, research involving the killing of the virus with light, heat and disinfectants, and he — as he’s known to do — decided to freestyle a bit, just going off extemporaneously about the possibility of getting “light inside the body” and the likelihood that disinfectants might somehow be injected or ingested in order to “clean” out the lungs. A brighter president might have simply thanked Bryan, encouraged the work, and then expressed empathy for the families of the 50,000 dead, but Trump had to insinuate himself into the story by directing Bryan to take what they’d learned about the virus’s response to heat, light and disinfectants, and somehow figure out how to translate that into a treatment… Something like this, given what we know about Donald Trump, was bound to happen.

Donald Trump, feeling the need to look presidential going into the 2020 election, and having been robbed of his ability to hold his ridiculous rallies by the pandemic, had the bright idea that he’d hold daily press conferences, where he’d talk about how much he’d been doing for the American people, how we’d be reopening society soon, etc. The only problem is, he never had anything of real value to convey at these laughable press events, so he’d go off on tangents about how little credit he’s received, the extent to which the Obama administration was responsible, and the promise of untested miracle cures like hydroxychloroquine… which, by the way, the FDA just said was neither safe nor effective. And, on this particular day, the stars just happened to align in such a way that the President of the United States, a man extremely ill-suited for the job, even during the best of times, walked out on stage and appeared to suggest that people might be well-served by self-medicating with bleach… No, he did not stare directly into the camera and command his followers to drink Lysol. And no one is suggesting that happened. He did, however, broach the subject in such a way as to create a great deal of confusion, and make an already terrible situation worse.

This, or something like this, I’d argue, was inevitable. When you take a man like Donald Trump, who refuses to attend scientific briefings, but feels qualified to talk about what was covered during such briefings, these things are bound to happen. The truly criminal thing is that certain press outlets continued to cover these things well past the point when we all knew for a certainty that they were illegitimate. And, now, as a result, we’re seeing stories from places like Illinois and Maryland about people tying up public health offices with questions about the consumption and/or injection of bleach.

But, in Trump’s defense, this isn’t all that unusual. At least, I seem to recall a time or two, after Obama press conferences, were companies, like Exxon and BP, had to issue statements reminding people not to inject gasoline… I mean, it’s just something that happens. World leaders talk off-the-cuff all the time about the injection of things that would certainly kill you. And, yes, Barack Obama did once ask his chief medical advisors to look into the injection of gasoline to kill cancer.

OK, that’s not exactly true. Obama was actually pretty good when it came to not directing people to take their own lives. But he did once wear a tan suit. [#NeverForget.]

Oh, but here’s something that is real. At roughly the same time bleachgate was playing out, Dr Anthony Fauci, our nation’s foremost expert on the COVID-19 pandemic, said the following about our nation’s coronavirus testing capabilities. “We need to significantly ramp up not only the number of tests, but the capacity to perform them…. I am not overly confident right now at all that we have what it takes to do that,” he said.

So, as funny as it might be that our president stood in front of the press and talked about the bleach and sunlight being forced through the bodies of the sick, the fact remains that we still don’t have the testing that we need. And every minute Donald Trump spends talking about potential miracle cures, are minutes he’s not spending actually doing his job, and pushing to expand the testing necessary to counter this pandemic.

Oh, and here’s that video of Trump claiming that his comments about disinfectants and sunlight were said sarcastically to the reporters in the room. [As you can see from the original video, he clearly wasn’t addressing the reporters in the room. He even addresses Dr. Birx by name when asking if it’s possible to get sunlight and disinfectant into the body.]

But this is what we signed up for when we elected Donald Trump. We knew he was a liar. We knew he was a shirker of responsibility, and a passer of the buck. We knew he wasn’t the kind of leader who would thoughtfully analyze problems, but would instead look for easy solutions. And today we’re paying the price. First it was chloroquine, and now it’s bleach. He apparently can’t admit to himself that there isn’t an easy answer. Because, up until now, there’s always been an easy answer. There’s never been a problem that he couldn’t make go away by lying, blaming, and buying his way out of. And here we are, with over 50,000 dead Americans, while he continues to stand in front of us, on live television, searching for easy answers, instead of doing the hard work of being president.

update: It’s now Monday, and Trump is back in front of the press, denying responsibility for people ingesting bleach. Welcome to the new America.

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  1. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 25, 2020 at 11:20 pm | Permalink

    I already wasted you on this, Barky. Light is the disinfectant along with heat and humidity. You think simply insisting he was talking about bleach does something? You should have tried to respond to me in the last thread you started about this.

  2. Posted April 26, 2020 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    I know, Mark. We have gotten the same shitty president we knew we were going to get. He is doing slightly better than I expected, however, in that he still seems to have Dr Fauci as an advisor and I would have expected him to have Ivanka or someone similarly unqualified in that role by now.

    HW, the president straight up suggested that ingesting disinfectant was a possibility. If he was being sarcastic, he is bad at it and apparently doesn’t understand that you need to use vocal tone to achieve the effect. You have not presented anything credible here nor will you most likely. So stop pretending as if you have.

  3. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 1:16 pm | Permalink

    Did Trump say “ingests disinfectant”? I asked before. I am not sure but I am willing to follow the facts.

  4. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 1:25 pm | Permalink

    I straight up did not hear that. I might be straight up wrong. Lynne has straight up said that line twice. I am straight up curious if it is true.

  5. Jean Henry
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 1:40 pm | Permalink

    1)yes he said inject
    2) the light comment was clearly separated from the disinfectant comment and there are origin stories for both. The disinfectant injection idea was proposed by a televangelist in a letter to Trump last week.

    Here is the transcript, FF:
    “A question that probably some of you are thinking of if you’re totally into that world, which I find to be very interesting. So, supposing we hit the body with a tremendous, whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light, and I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but you’re going to test it. And then I said supposing you brought the light inside the body, which you can do either through the skin or in some other way. And I think you said you’re going to test that too. Sounds interesting, right?

    And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute, one minute. And is there a way we can do something like that by injection inside or almost a cleaning, because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs. So it’d be interesting to check that. So that you’re going to have to use medical doctors with, but it sounds interesting to me. So, we’ll see, but the whole concept of the light, the way it kills it in one minute. That’s pretty powerful.”

  6. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 1:58 pm | Permalink

    “1)yes he said inject”

    Huh? Lynne used the word “ingest” twice over the last two days. I just listened to 5 min prior and 5 min after what you provided as the transcript. I did not hear the word “ingest”.

  7. Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:22 pm | Permalink

    My bad. The president said ‘inject’

    His exact words: “And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs.”

  8. Jean Henry
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:23 pm | Permalink

    Is ‘inject’ a more reasonable suggestion that ‘ingest,” FF? What is you point exactly. Does Lynn’s error make Trump somehow reasonable?

    Why do you play gotcha as though that is the same thing as making a salient point? Why do you always act as if one error discounts a person’s entire point?Were you a middle school math teacher?
    Because you act like one.

  9. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:40 pm | Permalink

    Ok. So it was not “ingestion”. I wonder what Trump would say if he was asked about “injection”. Wouldn’t it be great if he actually was asked about “injection of disinfectants right in that same briefing. Oh look! He was asked. So without looking how do you think Trump responded to the question?

    ABC News chief White House correspondent Jonathan Karl, April 23: The president mentioned the idea of a cleaner, bleach and isopropyl alcohol emerging. There’s no scenario where that could be injected into a person, is there?

    Can the inspector Columbeau team tell me what Trump said?

  10. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:42 pm | Permalink

    Never heard of a vaporizer? When you inhale are you not injecting essential oils, many of which are antibacterial into your lungs in the form of a vapor? We already know the Healight injects UV light into the upper respiratory tract. An inhaler or vaporizer with a virus-killing agent would certainly act as a disinfectant.

  11. Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:43 pm | Permalink

    JH, I was wondering the same thing. I mean inject and ingest are close in how they sound but both are also words that mean a similar thing in that they are both methods for getting a substance inside of the body. But ok, he caught me using the wrong word. I suspect that he thinks it will discredit me in the future even though it will not as the gist is the same and there was no attempt to deceive.

  12. Posted April 26, 2020 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    I don’t necessarily believe this interpretation. As I said in the post, I think he just shot off his mouth based on a few talking points that he been given to him concerning the work of Bill Bryan, who had come to the White House to talk with members of the coronavirus task force. With that said, I do think it’s fascinating that right wing bleach drinkers are talking credit for having put the bug in Trump’s ear. Here’s an excerpt from the Guardian.

    The leader of the most prominent group in the US peddling potentially lethal industrial bleach as a “miracle cure” for coronavirus wrote to Donald Trump at the White House this week.

    In his letter, Mark Grenon told Trump that chlorine dioxide – a powerful bleach used in industrial processes such as textile manufacturing that can have fatal side-effects when drunk – is “a wonderful detox that can kill 99% of the pathogens in the body”. He added that it “can rid the body of Covid-19”.

    A few days after Grenon dispatched his letter, Trump went on national TV at his daily coronavirus briefing at the White House on Thursday and promoted the idea that disinfectant could be used as a treatment for the virus. To the astonishment of medical experts, the US president said that disinfectant “knocks it out in a minute. One minute!”

    He went on to say: “Is there a way we can do something, by an injection inside or almost a cleaning? Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs, so it’d be interesting to check that.”

    Trump did not specify where the idea of using disinfectant as a possible remedy for Covid-19 came from, and the source for his notion remains obscure. But the Guardian has learned that peddlers of chlorine dioxide – industrial bleach – have been making direct approaches to the White House in recent days.

    Grenon styles himself as “archbishop” of Genesis II – a Florida-based outfit that claims to be a church but which in fact is the largest producer and distributor of chlorine dioxide bleach as a “miracle cure” in the US. He brands the chemical as MMS, “miracle mineral solution”, and claims fraudulently that it can cure 99% of all illnesses including cancer, malaria, HIV/Aids as well as autism.

    Since the start of the pandemic, Genesis II has been marketing MMS as a cure to coronavirus. It advises users, including children, to mix three to six drops of bleach in water and drink it.

    In his weekly televised radio show, posted online on Sunday, Grenon read out the letter he wrote to Trump. He said it began: “Dear Mr President, I am praying you read this letter and intervene”…

  13. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 3:15 pm | Permalink

    “inject and ingest are close in how they sound but both are also words that mean a similar thing in that they are both methods for getting a substance inside of the body”

    Ok. So what did Trump actually say within minutes, within the same briefing, when asked about using one of those similar methods to get disinfectant into the body?

    It’s not complicated.

  14. Posted April 26, 2020 at 3:25 pm | Permalink

    I don’t know what you are getting at, FF? That he said that we were going to have to use doctors to test these injections? Um. Sure that is hopefully going to save lives even as it causes a lot of doctors out there aggravation as many of their patients may waste time asking about this and they will have to explain why it isn’t a good idea.

  15. Posted April 26, 2020 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    It took her a while, but Dr. BIrx got over the initial shock. Here’s her statement on what Trump said. For what it’s worth, it pretty much lines up with what I said. 
    When he gets new information, he likes to talk that through out loud and really have that dialogue and so that’s what dialogue he was having. I think he just saw the information at the time immediately.. and he was still digesting that information.”

  16. Posted April 26, 2020 at 3:29 pm | Permalink

    By the way, I love the “Lynne used the wrong word” defense. It’s really going to persuade a lot of people.

    By the way, that’s what real sarcasm looks like.

  17. Posted April 26, 2020 at 3:35 pm | Permalink

    For those of you looking for a silver lining in all of this, it looks as though Trump’s finally going to be cutting down on this stupid daily briefings of his. As to why this might be, it seems as though he’s finally come to accept that, the more that he talks, the more his polling numbers drop… It’s also worth noting that, the reason these daily press conferences started in the first place, is that Trump  didn’t want Pence getting the attention. And, with being out of DC for a while, I’m sure he didn’t want the Vice President getting the limelight all to himself. 

  18. Jean Henry
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 4:45 pm | Permalink

    Mark— if you use many many more words to say ‘Lynne used the wrong word’ then it’s more convincing. At least in FF’s works view.

    FF’s wordiness is just a natural consequence of the momentum created by the torque he applies to every Trump turd to try to spin it into gold.

  19. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:17 pm | Permalink

    I have never seen such a bunch of babies. You will never admit being wrong even when you completely humiliate yourselves before those who are not. The Healight is the proof.

  20. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:27 pm | Permalink

    How’s that Flynn prosecution going by the way?

  21. Jean Henry
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:27 pm | Permalink

    Hmmm… who sounds like the baby?

  22. Jean Henry
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:31 pm | Permalink

    Re Flynn— sounds like his defense is a bit desperate, spinning evidence as incriminating of the FBI (v exonerating of Flynn) before it’s been released.

    Who relies of the messaging of criminal defense attorneys as relevant information?

  23. Anonyous
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:32 pm | Permalink

    Trump did not show for his press conference today, instead tweeting, “What is the purpose of having White House News Conferences when the Lamestream Media asks nothing but hostile questions, & then refuses to report the truth or facts accurately. They get record ratings, & the American people get nothing but Fake News. Not worth the time & effort!”

    Talk about being a baby.

  24. EOS
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 6:55 pm | Permalink

    There’s an FDA approved mouthwash that uses chlorine dioxide as the effective ingredient. You can buy it at CVS. It comes as a liquid and a spray form. It prevents bad breath by killing germs.

    Chlorine dioxide gas is also what is used to clean the filters of the biosafety cabinets in Biosafety level 2-4 science labs. It kills all known pathogens, that is, disease causing microorganisms.

    I would definitely gargle with this and spray the back of my throat if I was sick with COVID-19, in an effort to reduce the viral load that reaches my lungs. However, I wouldn’t inject it.

  25. iRobert
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 7:14 pm | Permalink

    It’s good to see you’re doing alright, EOS.

  26. EOS
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 7:30 pm | Permalink

    Thanks. Internet is sketchy in the bunker.

  27. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 8:01 pm | Permalink

    Aloha EOS, glad you ate safe. Just so you know, you got left behind with the rest of us.

  28. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 8:33 pm | Permalink

    You sound like a baby, Jean. You, Barky, Lynne, stupid name, stupid hick, Bob, anonymous, Sad, Jon Braun, iRobert…all of you.

    Pretty sure Flynn is exonerated and someone is going to pay.

  29. EOS
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 8:35 pm | Permalink


    No one needs to be left behind. Now is a perfect time to make a decision that will impact your eternity. Romans 10:13

  30. Sad
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 8:40 pm | Permalink




    I don’t want to be left behind!

  31. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 8:56 pm | Permalink

    High power UV-C lamp now available to rent for the low low price of $199/hr.

  32. Sad
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:00 pm | Permalink

    One is born everyday

  33. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:00 pm | Permalink

    “I don’t know what you are getting at, FF? “

    I asked you what Trump said, during the briefing,in response to the question about injecting disinfectant into humans bodies. I gave you the question. How can you not know what I am asking? It’s simple. The answer is in the link you share…. What was Trump’s response? Come on Cassandra you can do it. The playing dumb act is not fooling anybody.

  34. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:01 pm | Permalink

    Hi EOS. Glad to hear you are ok.

  35. EOS
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:08 pm | Permalink

    Thanks FF

  36. Anonymous
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

    UV light, it’s true, kill viruses. It also kills healthy cells. That’s how people get skin cancer. It tears apart the DNA of cells.

  37. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 26, 2020 at 9:40 pm | Permalink

    Safety glasses included in rental. You provide your own skin covering.

    UV-A leaves human tissue alone in the time it takes to kill viruses.

  38. Posted April 26, 2020 at 10:44 pm | Permalink

    No worries, FF. I find that I don’t really care what you are getting at.

  39. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 3:50 am | Permalink

    5 -10 minutes after Trump did not “straight up tell people to ingest disinfectant, a reporter straight up asked this question: “The idea of a cleaner, bleach and isopropyl alcohol emerging, there is no scenario where that could be injected into a person, is there?”

    Trump straight up responded: “It wouldn’t be through injection. “

    Cassandra straight up does not know what she is talking about. She is smart enough to realize at some point she is straight up wrong. But she is straight up deceitful enough to pretend like the truth does not matter.

  40. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 3:59 am | Permalink

    The Inspector ColuMbeau Team might be right that it does not really matter if Trump said “ingest into the body“ or “inject into the body”. But it does matter if Trump did not say either of those things. Re-read what he said.

  41. AP
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 6:04 am | Permalink

    Wow Mark, focusing on injecting disinfectant instead of bankrupting donor states. You know your audience.

  42. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:40 am | Permalink

    Trump has been pulled off of daily briefings by his communications team. If it weren’t for all those liberal meanies pretending he’d made Critical mistakes when he obviously didn’t, he’d probably still be at it.

  43. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:49 am | Permalink

    The President takes orders from his team.

  44. Kit
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    You cannot have it both ways, you idiots. You cannot say, “Donald Trump said nothing wrong,” while he’s attributing his stupid remarks to sarcasm.

  45. John Brown
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:53 am | Permalink

    Agent orange takes orders from whoever holds his debt. He is a traitor who will be revealed and executed accordingly.

  46. Posted April 27, 2020 at 10:29 am | Permalink

    FF, like it or not, Trump DID say, “And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in a minute. One minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning. Because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs.”

    He said it in a way that in no way indicated that he was being sarcastic as he now claims. I am sure he would NEVER lie about such a thing *snort* (/sarcasm)

    If he answered a follow-up question correctly it is too late. The damage has been done.

  47. EOS
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 11:11 am | Permalink

    If those were his words, then it is obvious he was asking a question, … is there a way we can do something like that????? I’m sure there are researchers investigating that possibility.

    Is it possible that when they insert a tube in the lungs to drain excess fluid, that they could lavage the surface of the lungs with a solution that could kill the virus and then suction that fluid off immediately? It is not outside the realm of possibilities that something like this could help a patient who is near death.

    Everything he says isn’t stupid, nor is he responsible for every negative thing that happens in the world.

    On another note, there were a number of Democratic run cities that had an unsustainable economic outlook before the virus. The vast majority of taxpayers in the nation, who have local governments that have lived within their means, are strongly in favor of Trump’s reluctance to make them pay for Democratic corruption and excesses. No green new deal, no carbon neutrality, no socialistic minimum income for all. And the Dems will lose control of the House if they keep promoting these expensive solutions at a time when the economy is stressed.

  48. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 11:12 am | Permalink

    I agree that he may have been bullshitting that it was “sarcasm”—although I did not listen to the whole conference—so maybe he was referring to some other exchange…If he is not talking about “ingestion” and he was not talking about intravenous “ injection” then what might he have been talking about? Apparently they are fogging/ misting “inside” spaces in China because it kills the virus very quickly and If you kill the virus on “inside” places the virus can’t get into the lungs and do a “number”. I realize that is some mental gymnastics but it is possible he was talking about misting interiors right? Let’s assume he wasn’t: Are you aware that inhaling alcohol mist/vapor has been used in other medical setting for respiratory problems? Are you aware that it has been proposed that inhaling alcohol vapor might help especially in the upper respiratory track?

    “Ingestion” implies swallowing and entering the bloodstream through the digestive tract. “Injection” does not imply intravenous injection but it could be inferred. Your inference in light of his clarification within minutes of the confusion is indicative of a few things. 1) Cassandra does not know what she is talking about; 2) Cassandra loves to hate Trump more than she loves simple truths.

    When you are dishonest either blatantly or by way of extreme bias you are the one doing the damage. I don’t think anything will stop Princess Cassandra from laughing it up though. She will be ok.

    My advice: Support your president!

  49. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 11:22 am | Permalink

    EOS, I am dumb about this stuff but apparently they have been having patients inhale vaporized alcohol since the 50’s. I don’t know if it is an outdated treatment. It apparently loosened up mucus. Not sure. Read about it in an article totally unrelated to Corona years ago.

    Also read a recent article from a Japanese scientist proposing the possibility of inhaling vaporized alcohol to kill the virus especially in the upper respiratory tract and throat.

    Cassandra, I don’t think it is a huge stretch to interpret Trump as saying we *might* be able to inject a mist/vapor into patients throats and lungs. Maybe? More likely than the president saying we should drink Lysol and shoot Clorox into our veins, right Cassandra?

  50. EOS
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 11:50 am | Permalink

    You are right FF. Persons with lung diseases frequently use a “nebulizer” to vaporize medications and deliver them directly to the lungs. Ethanol could very well be an effective disinfectant in this way. Ethanol kills viruses and bacteria within seconds, while Lysol needs a 30 minute contact time for complete effectiveness. Trump has been talking for a number of days/hours without any script and sometimes does not use the correct medical terms. I wouldn’t choose him as my personnel physician, but will vote for him again for President.

  51. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 1:23 pm | Permalink

    If anyone ever needed proof that total fealty to a leader makes one elaborately stupid, this thread would be it.

  52. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 2:08 pm | Permalink

    If anyone ever needed proof that total hated of a leader makes one elaborately stupid, this thread would be it.

    Jean and her friends are extraordinarily prone to bias.

  53. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 2:50 pm | Permalink

    FF– I will admit to bias against Trump. I’m sure most here would. We’re proud of it.

    Do you admit to any bias whatsoever?

  54. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 3:17 pm | Permalink

    Jean is proud of her bias against another person? That is disturbing. You are never going to get past the bigot brain phase thinking like that Jean.

    That might be worse than how the average Clansmen feels about their own bias. Jean is crazy. Maybe your friends will step in and defend you? Maybe they agree with you? Wow.


  55. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 3:45 pm | Permalink

    I am proud of my bias against a leader who has been well-demonstrated to be personally and professionally corrupt, anti-democratic/totalitarian in inclination and unbelievably stupid, FF. Yes. Every human inclination has positive and negative aspects. People without bias also lack discernment. The hard of our independent though is critical capacity which is disabled by those without bias. Another word for bias is POV.

    If one can see one’s own bias, one has some chance of mediating against it.

    If a person, like you, refuses to see their own bias (in other words, refuses to acknowledge the limitations of their perspective) then they are more susceptible to delusion. And to being taken as a mark by con artists.

    An inability to make such distinctions is a hallmark of poor reality-testing, so you may want to think more about why you feel a need to call me a #psycho for simply being able to acknowledge my own bias/POV. You incapacity to distinguish your POV from absolute truth is a pretty standard line item on tests for psychosis.

  56. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

    It is normal to have bias pop up. Normal people recognize bias as a bad thing that needs to be identified and discarded. There is no such thing as a normal person who is proud of their bias. That’s crazy. That is not the bad part. The bad part is your abnormalities are a regressive force in the world. Your only redeeming quality is you lack self awareness to such an extent that you say this crazy shit. Please stop using your real name. You have children to consider.

  57. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 4:19 pm | Permalink

  58. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

    “Biases can be practical and common (such as avoiding a dangerously shaky bridge) but sometimes negative biases can develop as well. Some examples of these are discriminatory biases (such as sexism) or self-delusional biases (like an egocentric bias).”

    I would equate my bias against Donald Trump to the kind of bias one feels towards a ‘dangerous shaky bridge’.

  59. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 4:22 pm | Permalink

    Have fun FF:

  60. Posted April 27, 2020 at 4:49 pm | Permalink

    OH GAWD Jean. Now we are going to have to endure days or even weeks if not months of FF showing us that he doesn’t understand the concept of bias just like he doesn’t understand Homer or any number of other things.

  61. Jean Henry
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 4:54 pm | Permalink

    I’m guessing his kids are pleased he uses a pseudonym, Lynne.

  62. Anonymous
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 5:42 pm | Permalink

    At this point I appreciate having read the Andromeda Strain for high school English. The truth is stranger than fiction.

  63. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 7:18 pm | Permalink

    No Cassandra. I don’t believe you. Even with the “two maestros” teaching me it is going to take a lot longer than a few months to learn how to be proud of my own bias. That’s next level! You guys make it look it easy but it actually requires rare skills and temperament. Some say bias pride can’t even be taught and you are either born with it or or you are not. Let’s prove them wrong together! Student and teachers! What is my first lesson? I will do anything you ask of me.

  64. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

    You don’t have to be biased to decline to use a dangerous bridge. If you have bridge-o-phobia you might overestimate the danger or completely invent it.

  65. Posted April 27, 2020 at 8:08 pm | Permalink

  66. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 8:29 pm | Permalink

    I am imagining a Bias Pride Parade 2020 with speeches from Jean Henry and Lynne. Sad can have a float of guys in short-shorts dancing. It is going to be like Martin Luther King’s “March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom” except a lot more important, intelligent and progressive. Maynard will even be invited.

  67. Sad
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:17 pm | Permalink

    A parade violates our directive to practice social distancing.

    Wasn’t it parades that contributed to the 1918 breakout?

    All I’ve worn for the last 6 weeks is short shorts.

  68. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 27, 2020 at 9:26 pm | Permalink

    Jean has a dream…

  69. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 5:14 am | Permalink

    Fake John Brown will have a float too. He will be do something creative with an effigy of our 45th President. Will it be hanging upside down? Or right side up? You will have to come to the first annual Bias Pride Parade to find out. Bring the whole family! Bring your guns!

  70. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 6:49 am | Permalink

    Good point about 1918 breakout. Given her hilarious bioterrorism jokes, do you think we should trust Lynne to throw out candy to the crowd? I’m thinking we can trust her especially if we have Fake John Brown’s security team keeping the conservative types off the streets and away from Bias Pride Parade 2020.

  71. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 11:06 am | Permalink

    Aloha, I think my early prediction that Hillary would be the Democratic nominee is looking better and better. Peter Daou evidently is a Clinton operative. He is calling for Biden to withdraw over the Tara Reade allegations.

  72. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 12:36 pm | Permalink

    I’m sorry Wobblie. We are only offering parade floats to high profile people, who are super proud of there own bias. I have never even heard of Tara Reade.

  73. Posted April 28, 2020 at 3:50 pm | Permalink

    I think it is funny how FF somehow sees acknowledgement of one’s biases as being pride about them.

    What is really happening here is that FF becomes a little unhinged whenever he encounters a woman who doesn’t act in the way he thinks women should act. e.g. If he tells a woman she should feel shame and she doesn’t, he loses his mind!

  74. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 4:18 pm | Permalink

    “I will admit to bias against Trump. I’m sure most here would. We’re proud of it.”—Jean Henry

    Awesome analysis Cassandra! Save your great insights for the Bias Pride Parade though. You will be mic’d up to a loud mobile PA system so everyone can listen to your wisdom.

    May I suggest you cut my name out and just address the crowd? It will amazing to watch your wisdom wash over the masses: “What is really happening here is that you men in the crowd become a little unhinged whenever you encounter a woman who doesn’t act in the way you think women should act. If you tell a woman she should feel shame and she doesn’t, you loses your minds! You men out there don’t like outspoken women. Because you are weak. Luckily men like you are dying off and will be replaced with less fragile men. No tears for men. Especially you white privileged men. Not one of you patriarchy supporting men is going to make me ashamed of my bias I love.”

    It is going to be amazing Cassandra! Bias Pride 2020!

  75. Jean Henry
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    I AM proud of my bias against Trump. Just as I would be proud of my bias against Joseph McCarthy or Roy Cohn, who mentored Trump when he was young.

    He’s truly evil in my mind. I have never felt that way about any other president, even W who was criminally stupid, but at least knew it.

  76. Jean Henry
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 4:41 pm | Permalink

    HW– I tried very hard to avoid the shaky bridge, but I was forced to cross it by assholes like you. I don’t think anything about our current scenario suggests that my fear was unjustified.

  77. Posted April 28, 2020 at 4:52 pm | Permalink

    I will admit that it is kind of neat to be able to make a statement like “FF becomes a little unhinged whenever he encounters a woman who doesn’t act in the way he thinks women should act.” and then have him prove it in his next comment. Thanks FF!

  78. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 5:36 pm | Permalink

    It’s called gephyrophobia. Fear of Donald Trump is what you really have. The politicians you support and their milieu are threatened by his commitment to restoring justice so you resonate like an instrument to their wishes and hate him with all you’ve got. It’s coming, Jean. FISA declassification is the START.

  79. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    Save it for your Bias Pride speeches ladies!

  80. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 6:07 pm | Permalink

    Paraphrasing Lynne’s previous statements = evidence FF is unhinged. Haha.

  81. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    I think there was a little Jean thrown in there too. Psycho stuff I know.

  82. Jean Henry
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

    HW— have you looked up the origin of the term ‘Trump Derangement Syndrome?’
    It was originally used in reference to Obama and applied to those who hated him.
    It’s a political term used to describe and dismiss fierce opposition to a leader. It’s meaningless. If I have it re Trump, then you, FF and EOS has it re Obama. It’s not the wicked burn you seem to think it is.

    You are an emotional infant.

  83. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 7:23 pm | Permalink

    It’s not used that way in the Trump era. You are truly deranged. I don’t think it’s a “wicked burn”. I’m sure. It’s just a fact of life. Look at all the stupid things TDS people predicted that didn’t come true. Look how big of a fuckin’ deal you made out of all that garbage.

  84. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 7:37 pm | Permalink

    Jean knows what things mean.

  85. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 8:00 pm | Permalink

    1) It was originally used in reference to Obama and applied to those who hated him.

    2)It’s a political term used to describe and dismiss fierce opposition to a leader.

    3) It’s meaningless.

    4)If I have it re Trump, then you, FF and EOS has it re Obama.

    5) It’s not the wicked burn you seem to think it is.

    6) You are an emotional infant.

    Every single truth claim you made in that post is not true or is just nonsense. I just don’t understand how someone can be wrong about everything all the time. It is bizarre.

  86. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 8:03 pm | Permalink

    How do I have ODS? Obama authorized the illegal spying on DJT. Pretty fuckin’ bad I would say. You are the infant, Jean. You can’t face the reality of this world one little bit.

  87. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 8:18 pm | Permalink

    You make up statements by the President to ridicule him like injecting bleach. Look at what you PUSH on people in the form of vaccines though! Holy shit, have a look at the ingredient list on common vaccines. You are worse than deranged, Jean. You promote pure evil.

  88. Sad
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 8:57 pm | Permalink

    Doesn’t Donald Trump like ice cream?

    What’s wrong with that guy?

  89. Jean Henry
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 9:10 pm | Permalink

    Oh you are right, FF. It started with Bush. I never heard it used them but even more to my point then.

  90. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 11:23 pm | Permalink

    Point is you are out of your mind with hate. Look at what you did to Kavanaugh for example about the ridiculous Blasey saga and compare it to the kid gloves handling of Biden over the Tara Reade accusation. You aren’t principled. You are only for women when it suits your purpose (hurting Trump).

  91. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 28, 2020 at 11:26 pm | Permalink

    You’ll get right on it if it means Hillary can be inserted at the last minute though. Seemed like he was happy to let her take up all the time talking today. You could almost hear him thinking “God I wish it could be you going up against Trump again instead of me…”

  92. Posted April 29, 2020 at 12:53 am | Permalink

    Maybe Biden will pick Hillary as VP and then resign? :-o

  93. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 12:59 am | Permalink


  94. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 4:39 am | Permalink

    HW – I’m surprised you didn’t post a link to that video from those two Bakersfield Doctors, Dan Erickson and Artin Massihi.

    I thought it was funny to see the incredibly simple errors in reasoning two meathead doctors can make. It’s hard for me to imagine going though all that schooling and somehow still remain so stupid.

  95. Posted April 29, 2020 at 4:43 am | Permalink

    YouTube took down the meathead doctors’ video. But here’s a response from Barbara Feder Ostrov of CalMatters:

  96. EOS
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 6:24 am | Permalink

    YouTube has said that they will take down any video that doesn’t align with WHO statements. That would have included persons claiming that COVID was transmitted by human to human means just a couple months ago. I guess YouTube is worthless except for watching music or cat videos.

  97. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:23 am | Permalink

    Aloha EOS, you tube is just like all the other corporate media. Only simple minds really think there is any difference between any of them. You tube is more loosey goosey about what can be posted, but after the last three years of growing censure ship it has become a much more corporate friendly mouthpiece .

    EOS its going to get worse. You should have stayed in the bunker. Meat packing workers have just been turned into slaves by that great freedom loving leader you adore and his sycophants are going to force more wage slaves back to work—health and safety be damned we need our bacon.

  98. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:33 am | Permalink

    Those two Bakersfield doctors are incredibly stupid. Their hour-long video was loaded with very simple statistical and reasoning errors. But we have entered an era of idiocy, with the most moronic at the helm.

    One of the many stupid things those two meatheads said was that there was insignificant difference between death rates in Norway and Sweden. Go look at the differences in death totals and then tell me the difference is insignificant. Morons.

    Another thing these two idiots apparently can’t comprehend is that the sampling of the population represented by those who have taken the test, is not a random sample of the entire population. It’s a self-selected sample of those seeking to get the test. Morons don’t understand the significance of that difference. I haven’t seen doctors this stupid ever. Naturally, the Trumpanzees like Tucker Carlson rallied around these inbiciles.

  99. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:37 am | Permalink

    How do stupid people manage to stay so stupid? They can encounter situation after situation where their idiotic thinking is exposed and yet they still don’t learn somehow. Many, if not most people these days seem to be learning disabled to the extreme.

  100. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:48 am | Permalink

    The Bakersfield brain trust also suggested COVID-19 is less fatal than the annual flu. These morons aren’t tipped off by the fact that 23,000 people have died from COVID-19 in TWO MONTHS in NEW YORK STATE ALONE! Someone needs to beat that detail into their thick skulls with a sledge hammer.

    Rather than killing people with compromised immune systems, we need a virus that kills people with compromised comprehension skills. If the Wuhan Lab can develop something like that, I’ll gladly distribute it to every corner of the US myself.

  101. EOS
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:59 am | Permalink

    Except slaves don’t get the option to walk away and decline to work.

    I do agree with you that it’s going to get worse. Conglomerates, corporations, and places of work are imposing restrictions on free speech that the government is prohibited from doing. Anyone with a server can publish, but the isolated website printing the truth is so overwhelmed by vast numbers of MSM outlets in agreement and in lockstep to further a dystopian agenda that the sheep are led to believe that the truth is the fake news or “conspiracy theory”. Is there a single reputable news source left?

    When all the news agrees on the same perspective it seems plausible to consumers that it must be right. Few realize that “all the news” is generated by a half dozen individuals. And even fewer consumers have an intellect that remembers for as short a duration as six months. The average American can only understand short video clips which are removed from the Internet even faster than their attention span loses its focus.

  102. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 8:02 am | Permalink

    What is the death rate in the USA, iRobert?

  103. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 9:28 am | Permalink


    A judgment on Sweden can be made at the end of their cycle. It might turn out that Norway’s cycle will just be longer and the same number of people end up dead. I was surprised how close Sweden and Norway numbers are because Sweden was intentionally put on a faster track.

  104. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 9:44 am | Permalink

    Norway has a 17 % of population over 65. Sweden is at 20% of population over 65.

  105. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 9:47 am | Permalink

    The raw number of people over 65 is much higher in Sweden. Significantly over double.

  106. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 10:03 am | Permalink

    Sweden has roughly 25% more over age 80 than Norway per 1000 residents.

  107. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 11:10 am | Permalink

    Sweden has double Norway’s population.

    What totals do you have for deaths in Sweden and Norway, FF.

  108. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 11:18 am | Permalink

    HW, the US death rate varies from day to day, but generally has been between 1,000 and 2,000 per day over the most recent two or more week period.

  109. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 11:24 am | Permalink

    FF, I currently have Sweden’s deaths at 2,462 and Norway’s at 207. Those two Barkersfield numb nuts said the difference between those two numbers is insignificant. That’s moronic. The difference between 2,462 and 207 is significant.

  110. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    Sweden 2400
    Norway 200

    So 6 times the death rate when adjusted for population. That sounds like a failed experiment if we judge it now, but their numbers might be closer in 6 months because Norway is intentionally slowing down the transmission and Sweden is not. The older population in Sweden needs to be considered too….I guess a lot hinges on whether or not people who recovered have a built up immunity. We need to let these experiments run their course. Without control groups we are fucked.

  111. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 12:42 pm | Permalink

    HW, the fatality rate of all SARS-Cov2 exposures is very difficult to estimate with so little information on how many people have actually been exposed.

    I’ve seen three studies, all of which were done on very limited random samplings. One done a few days ago in New York State suggests somewhere around 15% of the total state population has been exposed to the virus. The New York metro area is well ahead of the country as a whole in exposure.

  112. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    This article seems to suggest Norway can keep their numbers low. I just think we need to judge these different experiments from a longer view. Will they get another big bump in the fall? Will loosening restrictions cause them to close the gap between their numbers and Sweden?

  113. Posted April 29, 2020 at 12:54 pm | Permalink

    Re: “We need to let these experiments run their course.”

    lol. you say that as if we have a choice. Sweden isn’t going to listen to us. Trump has squandered away the international good-will our country has been used to for the past 100 years. There is literally no feasible way for us to pressure Sweden on this, not that anyone has been suggesting that.

  114. Anonymous
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 1:07 pm | Permalink

    “Credibility gap”

  115. Frosted Flakes
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 1:20 pm | Permalink

    What you say is of course true, Lynne, as you framed it. I am not sure why you frame it the way you framed it though. When I said we need to let the different experiments run their course I meant we need to let the experiments run their course before concluding anything. The Sweden versus Norway experiment are on different time frames.

  116. Posted April 29, 2020 at 1:40 pm | Permalink

    FF, thank you for the clarification. I agree that we will not know how each method works until the virus has run its course. I admit that I hope that we will figure out things like better treatments and perhaps even a vaccine soon which would make the Swedish model look bad in hindsight. That might not happen though. It is possible that without those things, keeping things open will turn out to be the better course.

  117. bet HW that McCabe wouldn’t be fired and all I got was this stupid name
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 2:22 pm | Permalink

    Aloha we live in such an exceptionally parochial nation that most are clueless about events in other countries. My Swedish friend Matthias survived a 3 week bout, and says most Swedes are outraged over the public health failure.
    Heard from one of my Bahamian friends today. They have had 11 deaths which the Government finds to be totally unacceptable. They have had a 24/7 curfew. People are allowed to go out Monday-Friday to get groceries. Everything is shut down on weekends. He tells me they have an 8 point plan to reopen society. Allowing folks to go grocery shopping is point 1b on that 8 point plan.
    By way of reference Wasshtenaw County has roughly the same population as the Bahamas. We have had at least 56 deaths and counting.

  118. Posted April 29, 2020 at 2:46 pm | Permalink

    From ABC News:

    How accurate is the US coronavirus death count? Some experts say it’s off by ‘tens of thousands’

  119. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 4:37 pm | Permalink

    I think of the “death rate” as the percent of people who get the disease that die.

  120. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:49 pm | Permalink

    It’s impossible to establish an estimate of the number of people in the US who have had or have the SARS-Cov2 virus in their system. No research has been done to establish a reliable estimate. We’d need to establish that number in order to then figure a fatality rate for the SARS-Cov2 virus in the US.

    I did hear there was an estimate made for New York State. If I remember correctly, they said about 15% of the population of New York State had been infected. The total population of New York State is approximately 19,450,000. 15% of that is 2,917,500. The current total of confirmed COVID-19 deaths in the state is 23,477. That would place the current death rate for the virus in New York State as approximately 0.8%.

  121. iRobert
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 7:57 pm | Permalink

    However, there are many factors which throw that number off. One significant factor is the lag time from initial infection to outcome in every case of infection. Victims suffer for as long as a month with the virus before they die. Having a death rate lagging that far behind the wave of the viruses spread skews the percentage down.

  122. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted April 29, 2020 at 8:47 pm | Permalink

    Calling deaths covid when they are not affects it too.

  123. Posted April 30, 2020 at 2:34 am | Permalink

    40,000 Missing Deaths:
    Tracking the True Toll of the Coronavirus Outbreak

    (From the New York Times)

  124. iRobert
    Posted July 21, 2020 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    With Trump there, the re-start of the daily briefings will quickly degenerate back into a shit-show, like before.

  125. iRobert
    Posted July 21, 2020 at 4:31 pm | Permalink

    Trump is now doing his first pandemic briefing since April. The news stations are generally just cutting to it for a couple minutes and then going back to their regular programming.

    He probably should have put some experts on first. I doubt many people want to watch and listen to him drone on and on reading someone else’s notes for him.

  126. EOS
    Posted July 21, 2020 at 4:55 pm | Permalink

    Trump shared some interesting facts. 99.96% of all infections occurred in adults. The median age of those killed by the virus is 78 y/o and over half of those who died were in nursing homes. The number of fatalities has dropped 75% since April and hospitalizations are down 50%. They have found effective treatments in Remdisivour and Dexamethasone.

    Those who are elderly and those with conditions that make them vulnerable need to isolate. But everyone else should return to their jobs, schools, and lives. The virus is real. But the quarantines for healthy persons are political.

  127. iRobert
    Posted July 21, 2020 at 5:18 pm | Permalink


    I agree it would be the best strategy at this point. So why hasn’t the administration made it clear that that is what we should be doing? It doesn’t seem like it would be that tough to put forward that message.

  128. iRobert
    Posted July 21, 2020 at 5:24 pm | Permalink

    Without that leadership, it becomes necessary for the general population to do the mitigation precautions for the purpose of slowing the spread and keeping hospitals and medical personnel from being overwhelmed.

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