There was a protest against Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer in Lansing today…
I get it. People want to put this behind them and get back to business-as-usual. They want to go back to work. They want a return of some kind of normalcy. And, apparently, they think that’ll happen if Governor Whitmer just lifts her stay-at-home order. That’s not how it works, by the way, but I can see the appeal of magical thinking at times like these.
I know it looks as though things are finally kind of starting to plateau here in Michigan — thanks in very large part to Whitmer’s order — but that doesn’t mean that it’s a sure thing that the virus will just fade away. In fact, we know from history that something called a “double-peaked curve” can occur in instances where people ease up on social distancing too soon. It happened with the flu of 1918, and it could happen again. Here, on that subject, is an excerpt from a story that came out of the University of Michigan today about a paper just published by Howard Markel, Harvey B. Lipman, and J. Alexander Navarro. [The paper is titled, Nonpharmaceutical Interventions Implemented by US Cities During the 1918-1919 Influenza Pandemic.]
…Easing up on “social distancing” steps too soon, and too quickly, could give the novel coronavirus a chance to race back into broad circulation, (Markel) explains. Serious cases, and deaths, could spike again, and waste all the progress that has been made so far.
That’s exactly what happened in many cities during the flu pandemic of 1918 and 1919, as Markel and his colleagues showed in their detailed study of how non-pharmaceutical measures like school and business closings affected rates of excess deaths in dozens of U.S. cities.
Even though the world of 2020 is far different from that of the World War I period, Markel sees the same thing happening today that happened then, and in other disease outbreaks he’s studied.
“In every pandemic, there’s a tug of war. On one end, there are the economic and business interests, and on the other end is the public’s health,” he says. “We know from history that when citizens become restless and protest to their leaders about lifting these sanctions too early, another rise in cases invariably occurs. In some places it was worse than the first peak. This creates a situation where you have endured shelter in place sanctions and crippled the economy for nothing,” says Markel, a professor of medicine, history and public health at U-M and member of the Institute for Healthcare Policy and Innovation…
And that tug of war between business interests and public health were on full display today in Lansing, as many of our fellow Michiganders gathered to demand that rules put in place in order to slow the pandemic and save lives, be repealed.
VIDEO: Thousands of protesters, including many @realDonaldTrump supporters, flocked to Michigan's Capitol today to protest @GovWhitmer's latest stay home order, which includes restrictions meant to slow the spread of coronavirus. pic.twitter.com/jTLYUIKo66
— Detroit Free Press (@freep) April 15, 2020
For what it’s worth, I can see how some of the Governor’s rules might be confusing. I can see how, for instance, people with motorboats might find it difficult to reconcile the fact that, while they can’t take their boats out, their neighbors with sailboats can. It makes sense from a public health perspective, when you consider the need to cut down on unnecessary gas station interactions, but I don’t think a lot of people take the time to think these things through. They just see them as the capricious rules put in place by out-of-touch liberal elites who don’t appreciate the importance of things like hunting, fishing and driving boats fast over water. [For what it’s worth, the Governor left gun stores open, deeming them “essential”, which seems ridiculous. But good politics is all about striking the right balance, I suppose.]
And it certainly doesn’t help that these folks in the streets of Lansing are being egged on by a president who has made it clear that he thinks it would be fine to reopen society, regardless of whatever objections public health officials might have, and wealthy Michigan business owners, like the members of the DeVos family, who helped make today’s protest happen through their funding the Michigan Freedom Fund, which helped organize the event. [The DeVos family denies that they were directly involved in the planning of today’s event.] Of course, none of those rich folks were actually at the event, rubbing elbows with these Confederate flag-waving Trump supporters, very few of whom, by the way, were wearing masks. [I counted more guns than masks in the videos I saw.] They were supposed to be in cars, as I understand it, but a lot of them, I guess, decided that they wanted to make a statement by walking around in close proximity to one another, in spite of the public safety warnings.
What a coincidence that views about the Confederate Flag align with views about putting people at risk by ending social distancing. https://t.co/YAOdlCClkY
— Ben Rhodes (@brhodes) April 15, 2020
To Whitmer’s credit, she didn’t discourage the protest, or demean those speaking out against her orders. “It’s OK to be frustrated, it’s OK to be angry, and if it makes you feel better to direct it at me, that’s OK too, I’ve got thick skin,” she said. All she asked was that people be safe, and not further spread the disease through their actions.
So, on one hand, you have Whitmer saying that her “immediate concern is trying to keep everyone in Michigan safe.” And, on the other, you have the Michigan Conservative Coalition issuing statements about the stay-a-home order having come from “power-hungry bureaucrats.” And a lot of people apparently can’t see how wrong and dangerous that is. They can’t appreciate the fact that the only reason we don’t have more deaths right now in Michigan is because Whitmer and others took bold action. Yes, it sucks. Yes, we know you feel as though you have a right to your motorboat, jet-ski, or whatever. But the reality is that social distancing is working, and we can’t jeopardize it by stopping now, before we’ve instituted measures – like robust, accurate and free testing – to keep the “double-peaked curve” at bay.
Here’s how a group of Hillsdale County Republicans kicked off their venture to the Capitol this morning.
As of 10 a.m. this morning, Hillsdale County had 81 confirmed cases of #covid19 and nine deaths, the highest death count for any county under 50K people. pic.twitter.com/U6DifDOCbw
— Chad Livengood (@ChadLivengood) April 16, 2020
Let’s say, however, that certain parts of Whitmer’s order are too strict. Let’s say that she went too far when she said that people, for instance, couldn’t travel between their multiple homes. I can see possibly being upset by that. What I can’t see, however, is attacking Whitmer for this position of hers, while, at the same time, giving Donald Trump a complete pass for dismantling our pandemic preparedness infrastructure, botching the rollout of COVID-19 testing, etc. That’s just shear lunacy… These poor stupid sons-of-bitches are putting themselves in harm’s way to protest against a woman trying to save their fucking lives, while waving signs in support of the man who put us in this position to begin with. It’s complete madness.
The scene on Grand Ave. in downtown Lansing about 15 minutes ago where conservatives have jammed streets around the Capitol to protest Gov. Whitmer's stay-at-home order. It took about 10 minutes for this ambulance to evade traffic by turning the wrong way down a one-way street. https://t.co/xxoGnfg3EK
— Gongwer Michigan (@GongwerMichigan) April 15, 2020
And I really wouldn’t care, if, by gathering together like this, they were just hurting themselves. But they aren’t just hurting themselves. [See the photo of the blocked ambulance above trying to get to Sparrow Hospital.] When they allow themselves to be used as political pawns like this, they’re not just putting themselves at risk, but they’re putting their families at risk, and everyone else that they come in contact with, including health care workers, like my friend Monica Echeverri Casarez, who gave her life to the fight against COVID-19 a few days ago in Detroit. It’s one thing to take risks that only have the potential to impact you. It’s quite another to take unnecessary risks during a pandemic, when you know that your actions have the potential to reverberate through society, taking down the old, the infirm, those with preexisting conditions, etc. It’s absolutely unconscionable.
But some people, I guess, really want to get back to dying their hair and putting chemicals on their lawns.
Aside from the fact that these people seem to have real problems finding the local Ace store, this one lady says she has to kill granny because her roots are showing. https://t.co/Tkm3k1DG8A
— emptywheel (@emptywheel) April 15, 2020
I don’t know if it’ll make you feel any better, but you might take some comfort in knowing that ours isn’t the only state where gullible fools are out in the streets, doing the bidding of their corporate masters, and demanding that the interests of business supersede those of the American people. No, the anti-science, MAGA zombies were also been unleashed in Ohio today.
Will be forever haunted by this image of protestors in Ohio demanding the governor open businesses back up pic.twitter.com/P0nivaYSsY
— future canon (@futurecanon) April 15, 2020
255 Comments
Well said, Mark.
Columbo always says “I get it” right before thoroughly demonstrating he does not get it.
People want Whitmer to be more nuanced in her approach.
Joy Reid: “ Blocking ambulances by clogging the roads to own the libs. Between this and the confederate flags I feel like this kind of says it all.”
I searched through photos and videos for 30 minutes. 1 confederate flag is all I could find. I saw the same flag in multiple videos and photos. It has a gun on it and said “come and get it”.
One report said there were nazi flags. There were Nazi symbols associating Whitmer with Hitler.
Anonymous has spoken about how the confederate flag means different things to different people. Maybe he could shed some light on it for us again?
Here is a challenge for ColuMbo:Show me a second confederate flag that was in Lansing yesterday. It’s always those two guys standing side by side one with the a confederate flag/second amendment flag and the other guy with Trump 2020 flag. The guy with the confederate flag has his identity hidden.
Why should we be surprised it is political when Whitmer has made it political? The reporting itself is highly politicized…Whitmer is trying to draw attention to herself for her career….If your families were not still drawing a paycheck (or two?) do you guys think you would be able to muster a tad bit of understanding for other people out of work. These people for the most part want to use common sense safe guards so they can go to work. It is obvious. What was it? 35% work trucks? What percentage did not use social distancing? 5% of 3000?
I have an idea. If your family is still getting paid find 3 families that are not getting a paycheck and split your paycheck up with them equally. Why not?
https://www.michiganadvance.com/2020/04/15/whitmer-stay-home-order-protest-turns-into-trump-celebration-with-confederate-flags-and-guns/
I wonder if the people that write over at Michigan Advance would like to answer a few questions about the confederate flag/ Trump picture in the article.
1) It is not a big deal but the image was manipulated. It was reversed. Readability I suppose….Was there any other manipulation done to the photo?
2) Did the photographer or anyone at your news blog try to interview the guy waving the confederate flag? If not. Why not?
3) Do you know how long the confederate flag was waved by that guy? I am curious because there are a few different pov’s both video and photo and they all appear to happen within a very short period of time. I found it odd that I could not find other pictures of the confederate flag outside of that very short period of time.
4) Feel free to add anything info you have about the events surrounding this picture at the “conservative protest”.
“People want Whitmer to be more nuanced in her approach.” — FF
And they show this by flying confederate and nazi flags.
As far as I can tell exactly 1 confederate flag was in Lansing. Zero Nazi flags. The Swastikas were used to equate Whitmer and Dems with Nazis.
Thank you for sharing the link to back up my comment FF.
Have you queried MI Advance av=bout the photos? Or are you just asking it here, where you won’t get an answer.
This Advance MI photos are being carried now by the AP wire service, FF.
You’d better get to work breaking the story that they are fake, based on no evidence. Sheep!
https://apnews.com/098496d0ade7c499110dc2302d5cdbde
“The Swastikas were used to equate Whitmer and Dems with Nazis.”
“People want Whitmer to be more nuanced in her approach.”
It kind of makes life more confusing when the unreliable narrator trope is introduced in a nonfiction context.
Anonymous just described my childhood.
Aloha FF, there were not as many traitorous stars and bars as at your favorite rally in Virginia a couple of years ago. Besides your buds standing in front of the Capital there were several vehicles in the motor protest flying the racist banner.
FF you are if nothing else an apologist for racist. They are so stupid and easily manipulated by the rich and powerful that they don’t even realize the extension to the Stay Home Stay Save order was modified and approved by the Republican controlled legislature.
If the MAGA idiots want to be pissed at some one it should be the politicians they elected, who in this instance worked with Democrats.
By the way EOS seems to have taken Whitmers and the virus seriously. Seems like they have buttoned down in the bunker. EOS has always seemed smarter and more honest than the average Trump worshipper.
This is the list of businesses that intentionally blocked Sparrow Hospital during todays ARMED peaceful protest at Michigan’s Capitol. Most of them are construction or landscape workers. Please don’t hire these people.
Soldano Family Chiropractic Centers
Bell’s Landscaping
Root’s Interior
Big Mane Construction
Wolbers and Possehn Pools
Maybe Joe’s Junk
Snap On Tools
Krause Realty Solutions
Warner Seamless Gutters
Sylvester Companies Construction
Green’s Tree Experts
Tammy’s Landscaping
Esch Logging and Firewood
Modern Drywall
Blue Star Framing
DeHaan Tile and Floor
Geers Brothers Builders
Davey Resource Group
Mikalan Roofing Inc.
Impact Mobile Repair
Finn Farms
Timpson Transport
Lansing Real Green
Professional Fertilizing
Pro Now
Dialed In Fishing Charter
VanDyke Concrete (VDC)
Dan’s Excavating
Sierra Lawn Care
North Star Antiques
Scholten Landscape
Paulsen Heating and Cooling
Choice Landscape
Randy’s Lawn Care
DJs Landscape Management
GVL Excavating
Shaffer Tree Services
Kerry Bentivolo for US Congress
O’Donnell Electric
Meridian Contracting Services
T’s Outdoor Services
Brookview Lawncare
Trent-Mor Transport
Rinzema Greenhouses, Inc
Envy MWS
Custom Electric
Tom’s Tree Service
One neo Nazi treasonous flag is way too many. If these fucking traitors all catch it and die the country will be a better place. The problem is all the collateral damage these morons leave in their wake.
Aloha here is a still shot from yesterday two stars and bars in one photo
https://scontent.fdet1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/93687088_3471671206182472_2228637768022491136_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&_nc_sid=110474&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=QZkmWJ0RCRQAX9gqa0L&_nc_ht=scontent.fdet1-1.fna&_nc_tp=14&oh=e1fd4d3f91f5fac0b94a41342a27da22&oe=5EBF086A
Washington Post: “Trump’s attempt to enlist businesses in reopening push gets off to rocky start”
Read more:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trumps-attempt-to-enlist-businesses-in-reopening-push-gets-off-to-rocky-start/2020/04/15/1f89df0a-7f48-11ea-a3ee-13e1ae0a3571_story.html
From Twitter:
“Some business leaders had no idea they were included until they heard that their names had been read in the Rose Garden on Tuesday night by President Trump. Some of those who had agreed to help said they received little information on what, exactly, they were signing up for. And others who were willing to connect with the White House could not participate in hastily organized conference calls on Wednesday because of scheduling conflicts and technical difficulties.
In short, the rollout of what the president referred to last week as his “Opening Our Country Council” was as confusing as the process of getting there. Instead of a formal council, what Mr. Trump announced on Tuesday was a watered-down version that included 17 separate industry groups, including hospitality, banking, energy and “thought leaders.” And on Wednesday, a bipartisan group of lawmakers received emails inviting them to join another task force.
The president participated in four calls with those groups during the day at the same time White House officials were playing down their significance, claiming that the creation of a “task force” was never planned, despite the president’s mention of it last week.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/us/politics/trump-coronavirus-economy-panel.html
Have you personally confirmed that the list of businesses you posted were officially behind the protest, Jean? I doubt it. I’m pretty sure that list floating around hasn’t been verified. It basically looks like a list of small lawn companies who are desperate to work and probably have no aid coming in. I doubt they’re all Nazi’s and deserve to be labeled as such, regardless of their demonstration. You are such an irresponsible, ugly person.
My uncle, a doctor in Michigan, nearly died from COVID-19 a couple weeks ago after working his ass off to save people’s lives. His entire family was also infected.
The selfish assholes protesting in Lansing can go fuck themselves.
https://twitter.com/4everNeverTrump/status/1250506390457561094?s=20
Aloha, small business owners have been manipulated by Rush and the Republicans for decades. This was an obvious political stunt The Republicans pretend that they are looking out for small businesses in the Covid aid package, but all these small lawn care and individual proprietary shops ate being dealt with as if the individuals are simply self employed. They are now eligible for UI, for a little while, but no support to help them with their debt load.
The Covid aid bill will lead to greater and greater concentration of wealth. Many of those guys at the rally will loose their businesses. Several economist warn that the results will be the greatest concentration of wealth in our history. According to JH we will have Nancy and Schumer to blame, not Trump.
Germany’s Reopening Plan:
April 20: Small shops and businesses
May 4: Schools except kindergarten; hair salons with enhanced hygiene & distancing
Remain closed: Restaurants, bars, churches, theaters
No concerts, sports or mass gatherings until late August
https://twitter.com/Richard_Florida/status/1250771230405394433?s=20
This is the first time in recent memory that governments have had to impose such sweeping limits on everyday rights to combat a major public health crisis. As such, there’s definitely room for legitimate questions (and disagreements) about what measures are effective, and warranted, and how long they should remain in effect.
And, I agree that government officials are sometimes too quick, and too heavy-handed in imposing restrictions for supposedly well-meaning purposes – so I think there are definitely times when it is right to push back again unreasonable government authority.
That said – does anybody really think that the lock-downs Whitmer and other governors are imposing represent anything other than well-intentioned attempts to confront an unprecedented threat – for which there is no agreed-upon strategy or roadmap to follow?
Against that backdrop, yesterday’s protest in Lansing was an embarrassing display of a peculiar strain of American exceptionalism that believes individual rights are *always* more important than those of society, or of the collective good.
Living in any society, and being a part of any broader community comes with rights – but also responsibilities. A big part of being a grown-up is understanding that it is sometimes necessary to make sacrifices for the good of others – whether it be children, aging parents, or a sick or injured loved-one. Right now, we are all being asked to temporarily give up some of our rights to help protect our more vulnerable friends and neighbors … but these people, like spoiled children, can only think about me, me, ME!
Bob—
The list was culled by a Lansing based activist from lists of participants on the social media event page and by documenting the logos on trucks and cars participating. I’ve been keeping an eye out for corrections but so far named have only been added. The owner of Chelsea Treehouse was interviewed on TV.
Generally activists don’t hide their involvement in protest. It’s the cost of doing business and activism. Some people will want to patronize those businesses because of their involvement. When Zingerman’s financially supported Planned Oarenthood, that was the impact.
I’ve spent a good chunk of time and energy supporting small businesses for over a decade now. I understand their interests and concerns. But sometimes small business owners, like everyone, don’t know what is in their best interests; they just know their current struggle. Quite obviously opening up businesses too soon is likely much worse for small businesses in the long term than opening now. What everyone wants is for this to end.
You can always be counted on to think the best of me, Bob.
Wobblie- sole proprietors can also apply for CARES act loans and pay forgiveness as well as unemployment. They are eligible for a loan totaling 2/3 of their pay— however that’s determined whether salary or partner share. If they have staff then it’s 2/3 of payroll. Many are also eligible for $10k in emergency relief loans.
CARES act loans are 100% federally guaranteed so defaults will not impact owners credit should a business fail.
They will need to repay most of it and the process is way too slow but if businesses fail, it’s not because of the CARES act. This is more protection and aid than small businesses have ever seen.
Businesses fail all the time. Resilience through disruption is required of small businesses. The CARES act can’t keep all of them afloat.
Would I do more?
Yes!
Was more possible given GOP control of the Senate?
No.
But Wobblie doesn’t deal on political realities, just utopian thinking. If you aren’t on board with all of his agenda you are wholly corrupted.
One note to list: Davey Resources (aka Davey Tree) is a huge company with lots of municipal and state contracts. I believe they are unlikely to take a public political position so am assuming for now that some employees were protesting in their work trucks.
I have queried the company but I’m guessing their answer won’t provide much insight as to there position on the shut down.
I am not saying it is fake. I am saying it was manipulated—it was reversed. Which, again is not a big deal. But I am curious to hear more about the events around the photo. People on here know the people associated with Michigan Advance. If they want to connect them to my questions that would be great.
There were not multiple confederate flags as far as I can tell. There were not any Nazi flags as far as I can tell. The Swastikas were linking Whitmer to Nazism.
Wobblie, you saw confederate flags on vehicles? Can you show it to me?
Snap On tools is also national and it’s likely a franchise owner was protesting. So anyone seeking to take action may want to just ask for a statement from their local outlet about their position on the shutdown and/or engagement in the protest.
No Wobblie. The photo you shared was not from yesterday.
If President Trump did what Whitmer has done you would be calling to string him up. She wanted to expand the emergency to mid-July! Forget surviving the pandemic, it’s now about surviving the dem-panic.
Whitmer is doing what Trump and Pence suggested.
Physical distancing.
FF— any news organization will reply to a specific query about their coverages. Please start doing your own due diligence and ask them yourself.
Do you support the protests and what they aim to accomplish?
If so you can join up with the MI conservative Coalition and the MI Freedom Fund.
I’m sure they would enjoy you company more.
HW:
Nope. It’s Trump’s delayed and failed action that will cause us to be either stuck inside for much of the Summer or pre sturdily released and so subject to repeated lock downs through the next year until a vaccine emerges.
We simply don’t have the data necessary to release people to work and travel. That’s also Trump’s fault.
https://apple.news/AueSxj3XvSr-ahCXlbCbgqA
I agree with you that it would be good to ask these businesses for statements. However, you are a total irresponsible ass for claiming that the businesses on that list “intentionally” blocked a hospital. That’s dirty Jean. You know how protest work. People go with different intentions and then they often get physically caught up in whatever it turns in to.
“Trump’s delayed and failed action”
Yeah right. Ten days after the first case in the USA he was ON it. Only weeks before China/WHO claimed it was non-transmissible between humans. The fact is nothing Trump does can ever be good enough for you. If your people fucked it right up wth millions of deaths you would still be thanking god Trump wasn’t there to screw it up worse.
FF — protests are organized and routes planned in advance. The protest route went by the hospital and blocked all 4 main entrances, reverting people from getting to work. But I’m the asshole.
Please tell this guy he’s an ass: https://youtu.be/1t-GzuZukQs
FF stop taking about fucking China…
WHERE ARE THE TESTS???
We can’t reopen without comprehensive testing. And we are at least a month behind where we should be.
FF
How many confederate flags and swastikas at a political protest are too many?
FF is right about the image you posted Wobblie: https://mynews4.com/news/nation-world/gallery/confederate-flag-bearing-trucks-park-outside-michigan-school#photo-4
The Lansing based activist I saw publish the list made it clear it wasn’t vetted and he was hesitant to publish it. He only did so because people kept asking and it was with a disclaimer. Don’t you see the difference, Jean? Your behavior is as gross as HW and his Qanonsense
Your excuses are pathetic. And one post after another. Diarrhea fingers.
Jean,
You have no way to verify the businesses on that list intended to block a hospital. The organizers do not know how many will show up. Protests have a life of their own. Having said that I think the people who were not part of the protest and who were blocked from getting to work, especially if they work at a hospital, have a right to be angry.
Jean,
Yes. You are the ass. A little nuance, please. I mostly agree with the mandated social distancing measures. I have been in public spaces 3 times since the 6th to get supplies. There is a spectrum of measures taken by different states. By my estimation Whitmer is the most heavy handed and most lacking in nuance. She is doing it to further her career, imo. It will back fire.
The person who made the list was a woman, so your source is not original, Bob.
Jean,
I have been told by your little buddy that the confederate flag means different things to different people. I do not know what it meant to the one man who had the one confederate flag in Lansing. Were there more flags in Lansing? Show me. Where there any Nazi flags in Lansing? Show me. I couldn’t find any beyond the one and yet people are reporting that their were multiple confederate and Nazi Flag*s*. I actually searched for awhile…
FF– Here is the map of the planned routes. https://www.facebook.com/michiganconservativecoalition/photos/pcb.3238163542916445/3238162619583204/?type=3&theater
Sparrow Hospital is just a few blocks to the East on Michigan Avenue across the river from the proposed end points. If you read the organizers posts they tell people that the point of the protest is to create gridlock everywhere, that it’s unlikely most people will get to the proposed routes and blocking the highway into Lansing and all entry corridors is ideal.
Please feel free and review the work of these great American heroes.
The character of the kind of people who call me an ass always heartens me.
Is it true that we must have mass testing beyond our capacity, to relax the measures? I ask because I am not an expert in Pandemic response like you Jean. Maybe there are multiple ways to navigate decision making?
Serious question: What is our ventilator situation looking like? I haven’t paid much attention since you guys predicted we would not have enough.
FF– I never said there was a Nazi flag in Lansing. I said there were swastikas and there were. I don’t think Nazi symbolism should be employed for political purposes. If Jewish people want to use it for parody, that’s there option. Everyone else should steer clear.
FWIW I was appalled when anti-trumpers called Trump supporters ‘brown shirts’ too and made that clear here. That was before CVille.
Now they can all fuck off.
As for the confederate flag: “means different things to different people.” Sure. How do you think Black people feel about seeing it?
Jean,
Why didn’t you warn people that they would blocking the hospital *intentionally*. You could have prevented a dangerous situation that was *intentional*.
Listen, I think most protests are pretty stupid and usually a bit dangerous. This one was no exception. I would never have participated in it. It does not change the fact that you can not show the business owners and the list intentionally blocked a hospital.
You could have been a hero Jean. Instead you have chosen to be a complete and total ass.
If I know the photo was reversed based upon buildings and directions of streets do you think I do not know where Sparrow?
#mamsplainer
Jean Henry
Posted April 16, 2020 at 4:20 am | Permalink
“People want Whitmer to be more nuanced in her approach.” — FF
And they show this by flying confederate and nazi flags.
Jean Henry
Posted April 16, 2020 at 11:17 am | Permalink
FF– I never said there was a Nazi flag in Lansing.
Maybe now is a good time to inform you the reason I call Lynne “Cassandra”?
“Is it true that we must have mass testing beyond our capacity, to relax the measures? I ask because I am not an expert in Pandemic response like you Jean. Maybe there are multiple ways to navigate decision making?”
FF– I provided a link to a NYT article citing experts. I never claimed to be one.
Obviously I have no influence over protests by conservative groups.
You are off the rails. Don’t you see how your defensive hostility and bizarro conclusions undermine the integrity of your perspective?
Ah! I should have said signs. My bad. Big big difference.
In my defense it was 4 in the morning so obviously I hadn’t slept much.
HEre’s the link again re testing: https://apple.news/AueSxj3XvSr-ahCXlbCbgqA
Which black person’s point of view are you wondering about Jean?!?
You have a bigot brain Jean. Fix it!
You have no memory brain Jean. I would tell you to fix it but I know it is not so simple. If I were you I would proceed with more caution in general.
If you slowed down and fixed your bigot brain it would lead to insane personal growth.
Bob– it was a car based protest and people drove work trucks. There were many photos of these trucks. It’s true someone could just make this list up, but who would do that. Its also true that parent orgs may not know their franchisees and workers are driving their work trucks to a political protest. But what is known is that these work trucks with identifying logos participated in the rally yesterday.
People can do with that information what they like and make their own choices. It seemed like information worth sharing. You can choose to ignore it if you like.
I don’t have a lot of power, Bob. You and FF keep conferring it on me in your arguments against me though. I’m flattered.
Jean is right about some-thing. Because blue link to NYT. Because expert.
You still don’t understand how this thinking thing works do you? I’m not even sure you understand how politics work. I’m sorry.
Tool
Here is the CA plan for re-opening which also emphasizes the capacity for ongoing testing: https://www.gov.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/California-Roadmap-to-Modify-the-Stay-at-Home-Order.pdf
Here is a state by state list for comparison:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/15/us/states-reopen-coronavirus-trnd/index.html
#theinternet
Any dumb motherfucker making excuses for neo-nazi confederate flag waving motherfuckers should move to the Confederate States of America.
FF– I have provided the California Plan in full as well as a list with links via a reputable news or of all the reopening plans (such as they are) for all states with closures. Most emphasize comprehensive and consistent testing availability as a requirement for reopening. The list also makes clear the Whitmer’s standards are not excessive but in line with most places experiencing our rates of infection.
I apopogize that I was able to find reputable sources of current information to counter your baseless assertions while sitting on my couch. It would be so much better if I had to go to the library and spend a lot of time getting old information.
FF
– actually going out and potentially infecting people with COVID = OK!
– making a joke about going out and potentially infecting people with COVID = EVIL!
It is like you want to prove HRC right when she said half of Trump’s supporters are deplorable.
I think Bob is just trying to prove that people on the left and people on the right CAN unite. At least when the topic is women and misogyny.
I suspect that it is more likely that the list is correct than it is not correct. I am just glad I didn’t see either of the landscaping companies I do business with on the list! If I were considering any of those companies on that list, I would for sure ask them if they attended the protest and would be sure to let them know that is the reason why I chose not to do business with them. What is sad is that their actions may end up causing more COVID cases which in turn will extend the stay-at-home orders. I would be more ok with that if there weren’t so many innocent landscaping businesses affected but any small business person who attended that protest deserves to go out of business.
FWIW, I sent my landscaper a check anyways and let him know that I will keep sending them even if he can’t get to my house. I have a friend who is going to do it for free (I think that is still allowed) until this is over.
I do not think it was right to violate social distancing rules, like some protestors did, in Lansing. I wouldn’t do it.
I also would not make a joke about committing bio-terrorism against my political opponents. You did that.
What point were you trying to make, Cassandra?
Cassandra might want to brush up on the laws being protested before harshly judging the people who are protesting the laws. This might shock Cassandra but not every person in business has a Princess writing them checks. For all you know you are the only Princess on that landscapers route.
#FWIW
I am just pointing out that you seem to be defending the people who were out protesting while you positively went nuts about how evil it is to make a joke., FF. It doesn’t matter if you wouldn’t personally choose to do either thing, Your different reaction says it all.
I know the laws they are protesting. I think the protesters deserve to be judged very harshly. I know that my landscaper is not getting checks necessarily from his other customers. I know this is hurting him financially and yet he is not out there protesting the law. He is going to be hurt more if this protest causes cases to go up and the order extended though. I certainly support measures to help small businesses like his survive. I only wish there were a way to make the people at that protest pay for the consequences of their actions but of course, there is not.
I will also note that none of the people at the protest seem to have any issues at all with Barr asking to suspend habeas corpus due to the virus. Not sure if they are uninformed or are ok with it because it is a man taking their rights away.
FF the landscapers are getting checks from the State of Michigan.
Probably more than they get working.
Unless you’re the boss. But then you’ve got savings from all the money you’ve been making off your workers.
Get real.
I agree with FF. It’s too bad that one confederate flag waver tainted this whole patriotic effort to spread the virus. Now the media will ascribe racism to this protest when it was supposed to be about killing strangers indiscriminately for fun and profit.
—“I have a friend who is going to do it for free (I think that is still allowed) “
—“ I know the laws they are protesting. I think the protestors deserve to be judged very harshly.”
Does your friend live at your Michigan home?
Neato
https://twitter.com/mjoyce317/status/1250434248776888321?s=20
I am not defending THE people at the protest. I am trying to accurately characterize the protest and accurately describe what the event was/was not about. It feels to you like I am defending deplorable people performing deplorable actions because you are in love with the fake little stories you are told and believe about those various people.
Defend lies and mischaracterization all you want though.
How much are you people going to freak out when she extends the order until June?
And with all your rambling neither HW nor FF has touched on the most important point.
Are you guys still able to work?
Still beating that ass every day, Sad. It’s what. we. do.
You’re still selling dime bags to kids in the park?
Unbelievable.
I am one of the lucky ones, Sad. Thank you for asking. People are going to freak out if they are forbidden to work in a month when a more nuanced approach could have been taken. I can’t blame people. Not everyone is pulling checks from the university. Not everyone has a stay at home job. Those people are usually the privileged ones.
Haha Sad. Sometimes I need your lighthearted approach. How are illegal pot salesmen doing now that it is legalized? I hadn’t thought about those guys. Fuck it. Let’s protest!
SAD— as I pointed out to Wobblie earlier business owners can get fat checks too . They can:
1) stop working entirely and claim unemployment and get a standard benefit plus $600/week
2) they can keep working and paying themselves and take out an SBA cares act loan with payroll relief for the portion they pay themselves or anyone else.
The only people left entirely out of the loop are the very rich (although many will get the SBA loans which sucks) and non-citizens, especially undocumented workers.
The undocumented are the people we need to worry about.
If anyone here knows a citizen who does not file because they make less than $12,000/year, they can file their deposit info here: https://www.irs.gov/coronavirus/non-filers-enter-payment-info-here
It’s also a good idea for others to check that their Direct deposit Info is on file because I’ve heard from several people whose recorded info was out of date or non-existent in the data base.
Why is the mockery around here so stale? It always has that funny smell. Communism has that same stale odor. Communism/liberalism and capitalism/conservatism exploit the female and male psychic aspect respectively; the female desire to nurture and be taken care of versus the male creative, competitive drive. You need a little creative fire, not a moldy old corny act.
So one idiot driving his work truck means the entire Snap-on Tool company endorsed that action? Leave it to fellow genius Lynne to try to find a misogyny angle in anything I said. Are you still traveling back and forth across the country Lynne?
Didn’t say that Bob. I made the distinction clear about what the list demonstrates and does not.
HW–” Communism/liberalism and capitalism/conservatism exploit the female and male psychic aspect respectively; the female desire to nurture and be taken care of versus the male creative, competitive drive” — wow. There’s bunch of gendered nonsense.
Midwest Regional plan to open the economy is on the works.
https://www.michigan.gov/whitmer/0,9309,7-387-90499_90640-526088–,00.html
FF– Here’s a charming image of our governor complete with swastika armband from the protestors yesterday.
https://www.facebook.com/LansingCityPulse/photos/pcb.10163427593075002/10163427586575002/?type=3&theater
And another confederate flag: https://www.facebook.com/LansingCityPulse/photos/pcb.10163427593075002/10163427633820002/?type=3&theater
Some blatant misgyny: https://www.facebook.com/LansingCityPulse/photos/pcb.10163427593075002/10163427619155002/?type=3&theater
2 confederate flags.
0 Nazi flags.
Multiple swastikas that attempt to associate Whitmer with the Nazis.
0 Swastikas used to show support for white supremacy.
1 person called Whitmer a “tyrannical bitch”.
500+ worktrucks
They could have planned and conducted their protest so that they wouldn’t be blocking hospital entrances, but chose to be assholes instead. It honestly was a pretty small protest in numbers from what I saw. Did anyone count or estimate the number of vehicles and/or people who attended?
These people are going to need to get a lot more support from the general public if they want to have any leverage to change the governor’s strategies in dealing with this virus. It looked to me that it was just some mess the DeVoss family instigated. You’ll never see them out there with those dregs though.
These assholes couldn’t even get our resident tRump-kissers to join them. If you can’t get HW to your tRump-kisser rally, you’re failing.
FF she was called a cunt. Or can’t you read?
iRobert– Doesn’t the governor need to legislatures’ approval to continue the state of emergency?
Whitmer made a mistake when she accused Betsy DeVos of involvement. A conservative PAC that her family contributes to paid $250 for a fb ad and had their name on as sponsors. There is no indication that she was directly involved.
I’m no DeVos fan but I don’t understand why the governor went there. She could have stated the truth re the PAC. Or she could have attacked DeVos for any of the legit things in which she’s engaged. The event was coordinated bu the Mi Conservative Coalition. They have no DeVos ties of which I’m aware– which is kind of surprising. I just assumed they funded all conservative PACS in MI.
No Bob, but fwiw, driving across the country is allowed. I have been sheltering in place here in California since March 18. I know you called me stupid for coming back here but based on how things look in Michigan, it appears to have been the smartest choice after all.
FF, what lies about those people do you think I believe? It is obvious that they are shitty people like you are. Do you think my opinions about your misogyny and racism are due to lies someone has told me about YOU rather than direct observation?
Oh come on Jean, you know FF doesn’t have a problem with the Governor being called sexist names. I suspect Bob is on board with that shit too.
I do love how they both object to the male protesters being held accountable for causing our state damage by not maintaining social distance during their protest and for blocking a hospital. Is there anything they think white conservative men shouldn’t be able to do?
I don’t think she needs legislative approval of an emergency executive order, but the legislature could take action to overrule her order essentially. The issue could also be taken to the state Supreme Court to invalidate the order I’d assume.
Whitmer also thanked Amway for their generous donation at her presser yesterday afternoon.
I wish she would at least acknowledge some things trump has done. That setup at the TCF center was a federal effort.
LIke how FF is suggesting that “a more nuanced approach” would help as if the problem here isn’t people who refuse to follow orders. Especially interesting considering how he went after me for wanting to get to essential medical appointments and then back to my home (home is where my dog is!). Your message is loud and clear FF, you don’t think it is ok if I (and perhaps all women or marginalized people) take risks but you are OKAY fine if it is White men doing it, going so far as to claim that those who have a problem with the white men are somehow believing lies. Um, no. Who you are is VERY clear here on MM.com and it isn’t pretty.
Jean, check out #DEVOSexposed on Twitter. I’ve seen a number of suggestions that DeVos finds the phony organizations that organized the protest. I’m inquiring now as to the details of that. I’ll also see how the legislature would have to proceed to challenge the governor’s executive order.
I’ve seen a number of suggestions that DeVos funds the phony organizations that organized the protest.
…is what I meant to type.
I think the public could organize an initiative to challenge the order also. That would most likely end up in court I guess also. But if the numbers in support were overwhelming, they’d get action by the legislature of some sort.
This was a BS stunt instigated by the GOP. They know they don’t have the popular support they’d need to actually do anything. So they’re strategy is to make a stink with a few crazy dregs.
Meant to type… So their strategy is to make a stink with a few crazy dregs.
I know a lot of Trump supporters and a lot of Whitmer haters. But none of them would go anywhere near the smattering of dregs we saw yesterday.
Did Terrible Ted bother to show? If he did, I wish I would have gone. I like to ask him about Courtney Love’s recollections of him.
Doesn’t HW want child rapists to go to prison? How do you feel about Terrible Ted’s conduct with underage groupies, HW?
But even if Ted were to go to prison where all child rapists belong, I’d still want him to keep making his biltong products. I have to admit that stuff is good.
1 “tyrannical bitch” written message
4 swastis for Whitmer Nazi
0 white power swastis
0 Nazi flags a’ flying
2 confederate flags
1 “c-word” I wasn’t reading
And 500 worktrucks—in a pear tree
Both organizations seem far from phony, iRobert. The one associated with DeVos seems the most legit. https://www.michiganfreedomfund.com
Biden won’t select Whitmer. The Dems already look strong to take Michigan, as usual.
I still think Biden is most likely to choose Stacey Abrams. It would cause all sorts of holy hell for Republicans in Georgia, and maybe even North Carolina and Virginia.
FF– your nuanced analysis of the use of symbols of hatred and genocides is really v impressive
It wouldn’t exist without DeVos. He all’s all the shots. Its bullshit. Not a real movement. Just more millionaire and corporate funded phony bullshit.
I agree iRobert. He’ll choose someone not just likely to serve him a state or two but turn over some other seats. Political triple word play. And that means a southerner. And a woman.
Unless Klobuchar brings more to the table than I imagine. I love Abrams but if she gains the presidency early on, which is a distinct possibility, I don’t think she’s in any way ready.
Of course, better than Trump. Anyone is better than Trump.
iRobert that Biltong stuff just looks like dried beef, which is a PA Dutch delicacy I grew up eating. I still mis it. Is that what you are talking about? DeVos makes dried beef??? What an odd sideline.
It’s pretty wild you won’t even discuss Whitmer’s draconian measures. Cannot go to anyone else’s house at all? Ban on planting gardens? I thought that was only for major digs but she confirmed they are cracking down on gardening. Michigan goes Soviet (or Nazi, take your pick) and you act like it’s the most normal thing in the world. If it was Trump you would be actually going off the deep end for good.
I agree, Jean. A black female VP candidate would trigger Trump and his skeleton crew of crazy ass-kissers to say and do so much to alienate a huge portion of the sway-able electorate. If I were Abrams I’d make it clear that Former President Obama would be a top adviser in the event she had to assume the presidency. That would reassure folks and trigger the crazies to put their true selves on display.
The Freedom Fund is. super pac not a movement. Are you suggesting DeVos funds the Conservative Coalition too because neither I nor Wapo nor the Detroit Free press found anything demonstrating that…
With all this snow we wouldn’t be going out for weeks anyway though so it’s okay.
HW: “Ban on planting gardens?”
WRONG!
You can mail-order seeds or get them from neighbors or friends. There is no restriction on gardening. That’s full-on bullshit. I have a garden and I’m expanding it. I order seeds through the mail and eat them from friends and associates.
The order only suggests stores which sell gardening supplies cannot be granted an exception for being an essential business.
I think every one of those people should get tickets for blocking traffic you bonehead. It’s the price you pay for civil disobedience. Breaking social distance rules was stupid, wrong and unnecessary. It is tricky to fine political protest however…
I also understand how people who feel desperate and scared, and those who support their cause, might take some risks to make sure their message is received. You, Cassandra, can do your part by being receptive to their actual message instead of promoting some fantasy land bullshit that these people in general are mad about motorboats and hair dyes. People were there for different reasons for sure. The biggest underlying issue however is the lack of nuance in the decision for what work is prohibited and what work is not.
**If your friend is not your tenant you are willing to break the law, Princess Lynne, but you are unwilling to withhold your harsh criticism of the people who are trying to change the rules so that your friend can Legally do something that we apparently agree is reasonably safe. **
Do you not see how that makes you look like a mal informed hypocrite?
The point is to keep people from mobbing home improvement and gardening stores.
People can borrow gardening equipment if they don’t have it. They can get seeds from friends or neighbors (while maintaining social distancing). Better yet, order the seeds and bulbs delivered. Delivery companies are in full unrestricted operation.
Sorry Jean, I was probably a bit unclear. It’s Ted Nugent’s biltong business to which I was referring. It may actually be that he stopped making it years ago though. I assume he stopped raping underage groupies too. I’m just giving him a hard time. I’m like that with former child rapists.
I envy you having access to biltong as a kid. I didn’t know about it until I was in my thirties. It was Ted Nugent that introduced me to the delicacy.
Lynne,
You said some crazy shit about your traveling around with underlying issues. You clarified your statements and we generally accepted your explanations as reasonable given your complicated set of variables—did we not? I think I even apologized…Don’t do your slippery slanderer routine around here. Shit ain’t working.
Whitmer’s draconian measures? Do you also think parking tickets are draconian, because that’s essentially what the penalty would amount to, and it’s almost impossible to enforce the order not to visit friends. The police are busy. They won’t be checking to see if folks are visiting friends. If someone is causing a serious problem somehow, the law may be used to fine them. But it’s not going to be enforceable in pretty much any instance that doesn’t involve other much more serious illegal behavior.
“WRONG!
You can mail-order seeds or get them from neighbors or friends. There is no restriction on gardening. That’s full-on bullshit. I have a garden and I’m expanding it. I order seeds through the mail and eat them from friends and associates.”
She fuckin’ confirmed it. See the link in my post where I said neato. They are cracking down on gardening. There is a prohibition on digs that I thought was for major projects like building a house but apparently it’s for digging in your fuckin’ GARDEN too.
I think it’s draconian for any person in the state be liable to get a ticket for going to any other person’s home. Extremely draconian.
I don’t see where you posted a link to that, HW.
Please repost and I will be happy to review and respond.
I’m digging in my garden right fucking now, as we speak, by the way. I’m even putting in a black current bushes. I’m willing to share by the way.
Fuckin’ EAT IT!!! You are smarter than average around here, iRob. Aren’t you starting to learn it’s not a good idea to go against me in a factual argument?
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/compliance-governor-whitmers-executive-order-121500594.html
MISS DIG 811 asks for the public’s assistance in supporting the State of Michigan during the stay-at-home order from Governor Whitmer and postponing all non-essential digging projects until further notice. Non-essential digging projects include all gardening, landscaping and any DIY projects.
HW, it will be like fighting a parking ticket if you aren’t doing anything else that is a problem, and the charge won’t hold up in court. They know it. They’re trying to scare dumb people into not being royal assholes.
I’ll publicly taunt the state on my garden expansion if it will make everyone here feel better.
Didn’t know you where being a fucking IDIOT going against the governor’s non-draconian measures, huh?
Were. You were being a fucking idiot by gardening according to…you. Right?
Good thing there is no digging involved in preparing my garden right now.
Whitmer on the gardening crackdown
https://twitter.com/mjoyce317/status/1250434248776888321?s=20
Digging with a hand shovel in your yard will not get you ticketed, as long as you aren’t going deep enough to hit utility lines. They mention gardening because some people go pretty extreme with their digging, using backhoes and stuff. But digging to put in a garden or expand your garden will not be monitored and will not get you a ticket.
There are all sorts of strange laws on the books that no judge or court will enforce. Unless you have a gardening party where you are not maintaining social distancing guidelines, and what you are doing doesn’t require first checking with utilities, there is no chance you will be subject to enforcement.
You also will never be ticketed or arrested for sodomy with anyone, except maybe a prostitute.
A person using a backhoe in their yard would be considered by me to be acting like a fucking idiot.
A person inviting a dozen friends over to help dig their garden would be acting like a fucking idiot.
A person using a hand shovel to turn up some soil for a vegetable or flower garden isn’t going to be bothered by police, who will be too busy dealing with real criminals committing real crime (which will be on the rise very soon).
Next time I talk to the governor or any other of our state government officials, I’ll brag about all the work I’m doing in my garden. Maybe I’ll send Whitmer an email taunting her. I promise you nothing will happen.
Non-essential digging projects include all (ALL) gardening, landscaping and any DIY projects.
“People can borrow gardening equipment if they don’t have it. They can get seeds from friends or neighbors (while maintaining social distancing).”
Is that true?
My understanding is zero un-essential travel or meetings. I suppose it could be construed as essential if the meeting involved a vegetable gardening but not for flower gardens or recreational plantings.
Better yet, order the seeds and bulbs delivered. Delivery companies are in full unrestricted operation.”
-As of 2020 31% of adults have never ordered something online.
-As of 2017 7% of adults did not have a bank account.
DRACONIAN measures for two more weeks! Unbearable! Bunch o’ babies.
-As of 2019 10 percent of adults were not using the internet. (Not sure why.)
That wording is only included to give them the option in the event that police actually encounter a person creating a problem with their yard activity. Using a hand shovel to dig a foot deep in the ground is not even going to be worth any police or other enforcement officer’s time, and they know they couldn’t get a judge to enforce it if you challenge it.
I have received many tickets in my life. I know the difference between one they can get a judge to back up and one a judge will throw out as frivolous and overreach.
The governor’s comments on gardening is essentially bullshit. Like I said, she’s saying it to establish the legal position for those instances which they fear which will involve an actual problem.
Politics involves a lot of bullshitting, HW. You should be well aware of that as a supporter of our bullshitter-in-chief. Did you take his comments about mutiny this seriously. That was bullshit too. You know it.
Aloha, you can go over to Ann Arbor Seed (Hertler Bros) walk in and buy seeds. You can mail order seeds. The Republican controlled legislature extended the State of Emergency till April 30 (Whitmer wanted 75 days) under the State of Emergency Whitmer is given the authority to issue the Stay at Home order.
The Covid relief act will not help most of the small mom and paw joints or the self employed (both of which rely upon cash flow to service debt). Besides the big small businesses have grabbed all the money.
https://apnews.com/dded8ead64598a3893f4046bbe857d2e
It has already been several weeks. It might be more weeks than 2 weeks. There are a lot of people where 1 week without income is a big deal, Jean.
I hope I didn’t shatter anyone’s dreams by revealing the terrible truth that much of politics is bullshit and bullshitting. I know that’s got to be hard to imagine.
I’ll concede the points to you, HW. But I still want you to understand the gardening ban is unenforceable bullshit.
I can certainly understand why you’d have a problem with that being stated that way. I promise you she knows she can’t have people stopped from simple vegetable gardening. I’d also be confident flower gardening would not be considered an enforceable violation by any judge. The state would know not to actually pursue anyone on that anyway, so no judge is not likely to ever have such a case come before them.
Trump on people protesting stay-at-home restrictions: “They seem to be protesters that like me.”
JON KARL: Shouldn’t the anti-stay-at-home protesters in Michigan listen to local authorities?
TRUMP: “I think they’re listening. I think they listen to me. They seem to be protesters that like me.”
What I meant to type was…
…no judge is not likely to ever have such a case come before them.
Anyway, you get the points on this one, HW. Though I do think I made it clear it isn’t actually a real problem. I did expect the Governor’s people would have the sense to define what sort of yard work they’d not be concerned about. I guess they are too rushed to work on such detailed wording in a time like this.
If Whitmer comes after your Grannie for planting her radishes, I’ll join you in taking up arms, busting her out of jail and overthrowing Gretchen.
Jean,
Have you read Chad Livengood in Crain’s Detroit?
Check that out.
Dick DeVos was on the radio which he hasn’t done in years. He promoted this thing. They were totally involved and now they’re super pissed because it was an absolute disaster.
They also paid for the December 2012 right to work anti-protest protest and denied paying for that too. They’re full of shit they’re a bunch of liars.
They want their self serving shit to look like a popular grass roots movement, and they know they can stir the Trump people up to make it look that way.
While I was looking, iRobert, I found this egregious example of GOP draconian restrictions:
https://www.crainsdetroit.com/coronavirus/senate-gop-no-sports-events-concerts-or-festivals-until-covid-19-spread-ends-or-vaccine
Aloha there are over 30 million small businesses. The Government has approved 1.6 million of them get all the money in that bi-partisan relief bill. There are going to be a ton of new poor people soon.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/paycheck-protection-program-out-of-money-small-businesses-shut-out/
Dems put off voting for more funding. Pelosi sees it as an opportunity to “negotiate”.
A court challenge to Governor Whitmer’s latest executive order has been filed.
FF, it is perfectly legal for people to go to another’s residence for the purpose of helping them out. I am not willing to break the laws regarding social distancing nor have I. So STFU if you are talking about something where you don’t have knowledge. LOL. j/k if you did that, you would never have anything to say.
Princess Cassandra,
There is some room for interpretation. Municipalities are interpreting the order differently. Individuals are interpreting the order differently—but that speaks to my point that Whitmer needs to be more nuanced and clear.
The easiest way to illustrate the confusion/ lack of nuance is by thinking about the “no travel between residences” rule. Whitmer has forbidden traveling between your own primary residence and your own non primary residences, except in cases where there is an “essential” task that is required. Lawn maintenance has been explicitly described as “not-essential”. If it is illegal to travel between the two homes you yourself own inorder to maintain your lawn , then how is it “perfectly legal” for your friend to travel from his /her home to your home to maintain your lawn?
Educate yourself. Think. Use some logic. After you do those things then you can harshly judge others:
“An extension of Michigan’s stay-at-home order barring residents from buying nonessential items or traveling “between residences” in the state except to perform essential activities.”
I guess I am lucky that no lawn work is likely to be needed until after May 1. I only need it done in order to avoid a ticket from the city anyways and to be honest, I don’t really like short lawns in the first place and would rather just let it be au natural.
I am also pleased that I can’t pay anyone to go shovel at my house today. Thanks Whitmer. I get to save some money!
FWIW, a lot of people are interpreting the order to allow for friends to go mow the lawns of people who are old or who are infirm. I qualify in the sense that neither I nor my tenants are able-bodied enough to perform the task. I am still considering just letting it go. Why should I have a friend do the mowing when I would rather just not mow in the first place?
https://www.sentinel-standard.com/news/20200413/michigans-stay-at-home-order-we-answer-20-frequently-asked-questions
From the link Lynne shared.
Why do golf courses get to mow?
They can have people there to cut the grass and maintain the course if needed … but nothing else,” Kent County Prosecutor Christopher Becker said in an email Monday.
There are multiple media outlets and municipalities that are interpreting the order differently—and that illustrates the point—the order lacks clarity and nuance. If you want to know for yourself take the time and read the order itself. It is short. I would have thought you would have had some extra time after being put into STFU mode .
Weather report: No accumulation on walkways currently. If there was accumulation my guess is snow removal would be considered essential to Whitmer as well as considered essential to your disabled tenants and neighbors, who might need to walk to the pharmacy or grocery store. It might come to a surprise but what is/ is not considered “essential“ is not directly related to what Princess Cassandra happens to like or dislike.
Is it becoming more clear why I call you Princess Cassandra yet?
No one cares why you choose to display your ignorance about the Cassandra myth over and over.
I am not worried about today’s snow as I am sure it will melt away soon and no one needs to access my sidewalk to go anywhere as it ends just past my property. It doesn’t matter anyways because the company I usually use is closed and will not do it anyhow. If it sticks and no one shovels, I am pretty sure that my neighbor will do it anyways because she actually enjoys shoveling snow for some reason. LOL.
I am fine taking my chances with my interpretation of the order in terms of lawn care but I do thank you because I hadn’t asked myself why I was accepting a favor from a friend to do something I don’t really want done in the first place. If there was ever a time to avoid getting a ticket by the city, this is it! Let the long grass and dandilions wave in the wind!
All the caveats about the order are only needed because people are a little slow.
Stay home, stay safe. Unless it is essential to sustain life.
How is that unclear?
Of course everyone thinks they are essential and exceeptional.
Sad, there are all kinds of things allowed in that order that are not essential to sustain life, fwiw. However, I agree that is the spirit of the order and as such, I have been convinced not to have my lawn mowed even though my friend was going to do it mostly to be kind but also as a form of exercise, which is explicitly considered essential to sustain life even though we all know that one can get the exercise they need inside the house .
Stay home as much as possible.
Easy Peecy
Of course FF and HW need to dissect it
Why do people have to make everything so darn difficult?
Because people have different sets of circumstances , Sad. I am sure those people who are being hurt financially are taking very little comfort knowing that Princess Cassandra is using the pandemic to her advantage by avoiding property maintenance she did not want to do anyway… A lot of people are on the cusp of not being able make ends meet and do not have the luxury of crossing their fingers that Whitmer will not extend the order or increase the restrictions. The degree of reasonableness in the restrictions is not calculated relative to how they effect our Princess. It is obvious the Princess had a sense that it is was reasonable to allow her friend to help with maintenance. I agree. The problem is Whitmer does not agree. The question is not whether or not Cassandra cares. The question is whether or not it is reasonable for people to disagree/ protest given their unique set of circumstances and abilities to perform their jobs and hobbies with a reasonable degree of social distancing and safety.
it will be interesting if people’s new found identification with those who live lives of economic marginalization carries over to after the covid crisis. There’s always been people struggling to make ends meet.
What are you going to do for them when they can go back to their shitty low paying jobs FF?
That is huge and baseless assumption. I would be willing to bet I, HW and EOS have more sympathies for the everyday working person than most all of elitist liberals on this site. You are smarter than this Sad. It is excusable in my mind because I assume you are fairy young. You want to avoid waking up one day in your 50’s realizing you have taken the fraud route your entire life—the route many in the mm.com community have taken.
FF, I actually do care about how people less fortunate than I am are getting through this and have been taking action to help as many as I can. Just so you know. I know that I not only talk about helping poor people, I actually do it. Directly. In addition to what I am personally doing which admittedly isn’t enough because well, I am only one person, I support all actions that the government does to help people in this situation. I support allowing contract workers getting unemployment even if they have not paid into the system for instance. I support small business loans so that people who have landscaping businesses or similar can keep paying people, including themselves. Long term, I would like to see a universal basic income and health care not tied to employment.
What I don’t like is the racism. because let’s be real. A very good number of the protesters in Lansing were explicitly racist by displaying confederate flags and swastikas and their message is pretty clear. They don’t want to be subjected to these restrictions if it is mostly black people and old people and disabled people dying. The rest are at the very least implicitly racist but are essentially giving the same message. They don’t think these restrictions are necessary because people they know aren’t dying and their rural white communities haven’t been hit yet. I guarantee you they will change their tune if they spread this virus to people in their own communities. Then they will find a way to make it Whitmer’s fault or Obama’s fault because the real problem they have is that non-white men have power in our society and they don’t like it! It isn’t like any of these people protested Snyder after his policies caused an entire city to have their water supply poisoned.
I don’t see you or EOS or HW having ANY sympathies for the downtrodden unless they happen to be white men or women married to white men. Yet, I hope I am wrong and you will do something to actually help people in the future. Like press for policies that actually might help people if we ever find ourselves in a similar situation again.
Hahaha. I knew that my choice to ask my friend not to mow my lawn would bug you. You are the type that probably likes that ordinance because you seem to be the sort to want to control others especially if they are not white men. I hear you claiming some high ground of concern for the poor but coming from you, it rings hollow. Don’t worry though, as soon as the order is lifted, I will have my usual landscaping company come over to make my lawn conform as required by law.
Short on time…Only read last paragraph. WTF are you talking about? I agree that your friend should be able to mow your lawn if he wants. I also think you should be able to let your grass grow as high as you fucking want. What you and I may or may not agree on is irrellevant to the question at hand.
I have heard arguments that it increases vermin, creates a fire hazard, and might increase allergies but to be honest I do not buy those arguments. Maybe allergies for the individual owner? Maybe a fire hazard if long and dry? Shouldn’t be a problem in Michigan But it does not matter because what you and I might think is reasonable is not relevant to the question at hand.
The question at hand is whether or not it is reasonable for Michigan residents to lobby to have certain freedoms to go to work / pursue hobbies if they are able to do so in a safe and reasonable way.
You have already revealed what you thought was reasonable. As it turned out what you thought was reasonable is inconsistent with what Whitmer finds reasonable. Whether or not you do not feel super invested in changing her mind is irrellevant. You don’t even live here Cassandra! Maybe that has something to do with your lack of investment? It has not slowed down the expression of your malinformed opinions—that’s for sure.
I don’t particularly like boating either. I know there are quite a few people who **love**being on the water so much that it almost seems tied into their mental health. Maybe outlaw skiing because of the risk of injury ? But allow boating? Is there reasonable harm allowing some old guy fishing with a little motor?
It means nothing to me personally but people are different.
(Let me remind you that you are someone, who has underlying conditions, and you were considering going out to buy tomatoes because you felt like eating a bowl of chili.)
Whether or not I like chili is not irrelevant! I do as it turns out. Who cares?
Princess Cassandra is in the building!
There are a lot of trades that are not essential but can be executed while maintaining distancing…Hundreds is work trucks went to Lansing to espouse racism? Are you dumb?
You can’t blame FF and HW for wanting to concentrate on Whitmer’s order. Anything to avoid the asinine behavior of their incompetent hero Trump.
With nothing productive to do (that he knows of) Trump is tweeting “Liberate Michigan”
FF, are you and HW going to help liberate Michigan for your brilliant war president?
Imagine being in the final stages of a new construction project. The family is planning to move in soon. Nope! Some situations create unintended consequences—like forcing families to move in together.
Whitmer needs more nuance and clarity, imo. A lot of people that actually live here agree. Educate yourself Cassandra. Try to stop assuming the world revolves around your particular needs and wants.
Whitmer is a freak. I support Trump. I have not been paying attention to the news lately so I can’t speak to what this “liberate Michigan” thing is about. I think Whitmer is trying to draw attention to herself by opposing Trump. She is doing it for her own career, imo. I look at her and I see a psychopath. Why is she always smiling? Yucky, creepy lady.
Is Trump going to organize a charity car wash to get COVID-19 tests?
When Cuomo asked Trump to mobilize the production and distribution of COVID-19 tests, did Trump say he has already done enough?
The last I saw Whitmer is getting about 70% approval for her handling of the situation.
And most people are following the order to the best of their ability.
FF would prefer a lockdown more akin to what China imposed. It was crystal clear and enforced.
I don’t think Trump will be taking Michigan this fall.
Even Mayor Pete would probably be able to beat him.
I’m actually starting to get mad at EOS for not checking in with us here. It would be good to at least hear he’s doing alright.
I just don’t like Whitmer’s goofy Michigan accent. It’s embarrassing. Otherwise she seems alright to me. She reminds me of just about every other Michigander I’ve ever met.
Our dear leader wants us to liberate Michigan, FF. We’ve got our marching orders. Let’s get suited up in our red, white and blue clown costumes and do this!
We haven’t heard from HW in a bit now either. He must have scored some primo bud.
“FF would prefer a lockdown more akin to what China imposed. It was crystal clear and enforced.”
Hell No. I have only looked a few other states . I believe ALL other states have nuanced provisions for tradesmen that can maintain safe distances. (I could be wrong.). Things like one person per work vehicle are no-brainers…My philosophy is slow down the spread so we can deal with the hospitalizations but once that is under control then assume 75% of will get it anyway. We just need to try to spread it over time based upon our finite resources and capacities.
For the most part I agree with Whitmer. She is like 20% wrong because she failed to be nuanced.
Her accent hurts my ears too…
I hope EOS is ok too. It feels like a month now. Sort of losing track of time.
She has an accent?
Yeah, the Michigan accent sounds like a muppet.
Do I have an accent?
Can you tell I’m from Michigan?
“A very good number of the protesters in Lansing were explicitly racist .”—Cassandra
—How many would you guess? We are keeping track and are at 2 confederate flags counted. Zero Nazi flags. Several Nazi symbols that are used to associate Whitmer with something considered bad—a Nazi. Do you not know how to think? Take Wobblies photo for example, it was reported to be a photo of a Nazi who was there. As it turns out the photo was taken 3 years ago in Idaho and the Nazi was actually a Bernie supporter who hates Nazis. Cassandra can tell by looking at ‘em though? Uh huh…
“It isn’t like any of these people protested Snyder after his policies caused an entire city to have their water supply poisoned.”—Cassandra
How exactly does the princess know these things? The Snyder protests in Lansing were pretty small. So you are probably right. I know people who were directly effected by it and they did not go to the protest but how do you know who was at this one and not that one? Answer: you don’t and it is just a bunch of rhetoric.
“They don’t think these restrictions are necessary because people they know aren’t dying and their rural white communities haven’t been hit yet.“—Cassandra
Again, How do you know this? You are white and from a black community, correct? Are you really so special? How is it that Princess Cassandra can just magically know what part of the state these people are from? I did a quick survey of the businesses listed by Jean. Some businesses were not online but even still 18 of the 47 listed were businesses operating in cities that are from the top 6 worst hit counties.
I fear our Princess is nothing more than a bigot brained bullshitter. Is this the way the Princess wants to spend the rest of her life, because I see very little improvement in the Princess—and this has been going on for a long time.
Agent orange makes his most overt incitement to arms of the trumptard militia with treasonous “liberate’ tweets. He deserves a trial, and then a firing squad, in primetime – highest ratings execution ever!
Wow FF – the lengths you will go to in order to dominate and humiliate others here is really something.
Does it give you a thrill? If you know what I mean?
It’s funny that tRump sets himself up for failure the way he does. It’s becoming entertaining to watch.
He could have put all the governor’s in the position of having to bow to him had he simply done his job. Now, because he’s failed so miserably, they don’t even have to worry about him pulling his help and support. He’s provided and is providing so little, they really don’t have any reason to worry about him cutting them off. They can essentially ignore him for the most part. He has just about zero leverage now.
His pathetic call to the dwindling numbers of tRump-kissers to “LIBERATE MICHIGAN” and “LIBERATE VIRGINIA” and “LIBERATE MINNESOTA” is laughably impotent. I want to start attending these car rallies with a giant inflatable Toad, the character from Mario Kart.
HW, how are you going to help tRump liberate Michigan? I want to be there to film it.
How about you, FF? How will you be pitching in to mobilize for tRump’s marching orders? Can I be there? I promise to do my best not to crack up watching.
Sad, I do assume you have a muppet-like accent. I’m guessing it sounds similar to Mr. Snuffleupagus.
As far as Lynne goes, I don’t know why anybody takes anything she says seriously since we all found out she wasn’t black.
Where did HW disappear to? Did he score some primo ganjah and not share it with us? That’s not cool.
HW has is out liberating.
So is EOS.
It’s been downright pleasant around here lately, except for FF’s bloviation.
But with this new ‘nuanced and proportional’ tagline he handed us on a silver platter, I feel like he’s easily handled now.
FF–“18 of the 47 listed were businesses operating in cities that are from the top 6 worst hit counties”
What does this matter?
Worst hit by the pandemic = more likely to have been exposed–so they chose to drive to attend a mass rally? To what end?
Do you have any information that indicates that landscaping/contracting companies are harder hit than other businesses? Because what I’m seeing is that they are getting their CARES act loans at much higher rates than other smaller businesses.
As we all know, Red states receive more federal aid than they generate in revenue– consistently, and yet they complain the most about government programs and imagine they are neglected by the system.
Bunch of whiners
Jean,
18 of 47 undercuts one key aspect of Cassandra’s baseless bigot brained bullshitting.
On the flip side 29 were from lesser effected areas. How many people from the more affected areas agreed with the spirit of the protest but chose to not go out public safety concerns? Hard to say….
How hard a certain type of company is hit is not the central question. The question is can certain kinds of businesses/ activities function with reasonable amounts of safety. It is a line drawing issue. Attempting to make it black and white issue is dumb.
From the Columbus protest.
I don’t mean to imply that all of the internet is an exercise in propaganda but…
From the Columbo’s internet.
http://markmaynard.com/
iRobert, I am sure you are making a joke but fwiw, I have already observed that you don’t take women seriously in general but I suppose it is a good thing that you at least make a show of listening to black women. They deserve to be listened to.
FF, I am grateful every day that your opinions don’t really matter. They are just the rants of a weak man who is afraid that his privilege is eroding.
Dear Cassandra,
You say many things but I never believe the things you say are true.
Maybe you’ll listen to SAD, FF: “Wow FF – the lengths you will go to in order to dominate and humiliate others here is really something.”
So much for ‘nuance’, civility, non-violence.
It’s not just Lynne and I who can see your brutality and pathetic need to dominate, FF.
FF, do you mean Henny Penny or Chicken Little? In the case of Cassandra, her statements and prophecies were truthful.
Everything our Princess Cassandra sounds bullshitty to me. I don’t know though. Maybe Jean knows?
DJ Rashida!
If you from the streets like me, put your tails up!
If you rep your city like me, put your tails up!
If you put in work like me, put your tails up!
[Hook]
If you from the streets like me, put your tails up!
D Boys on my tease, put your tails up!
Independent bad bitches, put your tails up!
If you know this how you living, put your tails up!
Where they at?
Put em up!
If you know this how you living, put your tails up!
Put em up!
Where they at?
Put em up!
https://www.google.com/amp/s/freebeacon.com/politics/rep-rashida-tlaib-follows-anti-semitic-instagram-account/amp/
From a friend who follows the Michigan Militia on Facebook.
Mark,
I promise you. Your friend is a bad source of intel.
You have to break the chain of embarrassments. How though?
May I ask your friend: How long has your friend been following Michigan Militia on Facebook? Your friend must have some interesting stories to tell.
“Greeting my fellow Americans…I am proud to announce my candidacy for President of The Unites States of America for this upcoming election….I will make sure every American has the necessities of life at the beginning of each month. Enough to cover your living expenses, food, and a place to live. And from there I believe Americans will have a sure vantage point to pursue what really matters and that is the well being America.” —Mark’s friend’s Facebook friend
Oh shucks. It was such a solid story though. Vetted by the Michigan Association of Columbo types:
https://www.lansingcitypulse.com/stories/gun-toting-michigan-militia-plans-protest-here-today,14198
The Association of Columbo Types of America should note: Mark’s friend’s Facebook friend announced his candidacy for the President of the United States of America months ago, in a video, and he received 2 likes.
Mark’s friend’s Facebook friend is not even part of a militia. He is a graphic artist and druggy. The guy can’t even purchase a gun because he is a felon.
Cassandra probably accounts for one of his 2 likes. She was seduced by his charming campaign promise of a universal basic income.
If it weren’t for tens of thousands of our loved ones dying, this all would be pretty funny.
Aloha FF since I am sure you have reviewed all the available video of your allies protesting the shutdown around the country, curious how many people of color did you observe at the protest.?
FF waking up and getting right to the insults and denigrating.
Breakfast of champions and all.
There were almost no people of color in Lansing during operation gridlock. It was disgusting. Just like KKK rally.
4:30
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s_tAmRbA1o0&t=266&feature=youtu.be
“That is….Mean”—Pam
“My gosh…My gosh…”—Pam
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2020/04/us-coronavirus-outbreak-out-control-test-positivity-rate/610132/
We have reached a plateau in rate of increase of COVID-19 patients, but that is because we have reached a plateau in the rate of increase of testing.
Sad,
It does not surprise me that you, who are one of Princess Cassandras most loyal allies, would use racist words like “Denigrate”. I suppose it is good that you use insensitive words because everyone can see plaint see how horrible of a human being you are. At least you are being honest about your complicity in bigotry. I am also grateful that with every passing day the opinions, people like you hold, are mattering less and less to the rest of the world. They are just the opinions of a weak man who is afraid that his privilege is eroding.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/denigrate
Aloha, thanks for the video of the competing rallies. I take it that your review of the Lansing Protest showed no people of color.
I understand why small —-and I do men small business folks need the economy to open up. They all carry huge debt, no one is cancelling the payments on those 70 and 80 thousand dollar trucks, rent inventory or the any of the other cost that goes into over head. No one is replacing the cash flow those businesses require to stay in business. Mine would be broke if had not been deemed an essential service.
You either opt ala Trump (and the growing chorus)to co-exist with the virus with all the attendant deaths and economic dislocation that creates, or you crush the virus, smothering it removing it from the population ala S. Korea, Singapore China and Germany. It could take 3 months or longer to smoother it
Two years or forever to coexist- there is no guarantee that we will ever develop an effective vaccine (our flu vaccine needing yearly inoculations might be a reasonable hope).
What strategy do you think our leaders should take—scapegoat China?
FF, Actually, it is YOUR opinions that are mattering less and less because they are the opinions of a weak man whose privilege is eroding. It really is a good thing. Young people are clearly less racist for instance and I think that bodes well for our future. Guys like you will die off along with your archaic way of thinking. And guys like Sad will replace you. Sad’s opinions are more up and coming and often are taken seriously. I don’t get the same sense of fragility from him, fwiw.
It does not surprise me that a bigoted person like Lynne would defend the racism so evident in Sad’s word choices. She clings to the archaic ways of her lynching ancestors which provided her the privileges she enjoys today. I don’t mind talking about Sad’s support of Lynne’s bigotry. My hope is that the more people that are willing to talk about uncomfortable things, like Lynne’s bigotry, the better the world eventually become. Lynne will eventually die and be replaced by someone a lot less bigoted. I *see* it happening everyday. And I know it *is* a good thing, fwiw.
Regarding “fragility”: I will confess that mocking Lynne is very difficult for me emotionally. It easy intellectually. Insanely easy. A formula. But emotionally it just feels horrible to say the same things to Lynne that she is willing to say to others. I am not strong like Lynne. It is true. Jean and Lynne are by far the most “manly” people on this blog—as the term has been conventionally understood.
I always find it interesting how white men so often perceive a loss of privilege as bigotry. FF is a case in point. It is part of their fragility.
It is true though that I have biases and it is also true that they are most likely biases which are less evident in younger people. When I die, those biases will die with me. It is actually a reason why immortality might not be good for us as a species but FF probably isn’t up for those kinds of philosophical conversations.
” Jean and Lynne are by far the most “manly” people on this blog—as the term has been conventionally understood.”
That turd deserves to just sit there with a light shone on it
https://nypost.com/2020/04/20/kentucky-sees-highest-spike-in-coronavirus-cases-after-protests/
I always find it interesting how often people, who share the same phenotype typical of American Slave owners, employ the same bigoted logic as their ancestors. When their bigotry is pointed out they often wrongly assume there is something deficient in the messenger. Lynne is a case in point. The logic of bigotry and the instinct to preserve it seems to be an ingrained part of her essential genetic makeup. Like a protective instinct.
It is true though, even I have misapplied general judgments onto particular cases—especially in my youth. The impulse to prejudge individuals in particular situations slowly died out though, as it often does, as my brain developed along normal lines.Many people like Lynne seem to have a more difficult time maturing past those primary stages. The genetic component seems real enough, fwiw. It is actually the reason why I think it is a very good thing when people like Lynne fail to reproduce for whatever reason. I think there are various reasons why Lynne might have an easier time, than most, engaging in conversations about her own mortality.
There is that fragile feeling, right after mocking Lynne’s bullshit, again. Seriously. It hurts me more than it hurts you, Lynne.
Thanks Jean! I agree. It is an important thing to shine a light on. I am certain everyone except the two you already see it.
It really is fascinating how for so many white men, when they start being treated the same as everyone else, say by not having everything they say be taken more seriously than what other people say, they see it as bigotry. It is like how Christians like to say that they are being oppressed when they can’t force their religion down the throats of others as they had been allowed to do so in the past. I am sorry that the move away from that patriarchal power structure is so painful but if it means anything, it doesn’t seem to take long before most people incorporate such things into their new normal.
You should read more FF – look up your previous ^^^ statement.
Yes. It’s justification of abuse and it’s disgusting. It’s more than than. The phrase “This will hurt me more than it hurts you” implies that the punisher is being harmed by having to punish, that this is a hurtful act that the punished has forced him into by their disobedience.
You guys remember there’s a pandemic going on, right?
Of course. That’s why FF wants you onerous order to be lifted for his more common sense approach. Because FF always displays such good judgement.
Luckily EOS thinks commenting on a blog violates social distancing.
Did you see Mayor Pete’s haircut? Oh man.
Trump was mad at the Governor of Maryland for doing the job that Trump can’t. He acquired a shipment of 500,000 tests from South Korea. Trump doesn’t like how it exposes him and his administration as utterly incompetent.
The governor of Illinois had a planeload of PPE flown in from China. He ordered that it be done discretely so that Trump wouldn’t find out and interfere. It’s great we have a president who’s not only a failure, but can’t handle others not being failures. I can see why HW and FF are so impressed with him.
“I always find it interesting how white men so often perceive a loss of privilege as bigotry. FF is a case in point.”
Is there something he said that brought that to mind or are you just mindlessly spewing hatred as usual?
FF— why do you suppose that being outspoken, forthright and I afraid to cause discomfort in others are characteristics that you associate with being classically ‘manly? ‘
What does that say about you idea of the feminine and what you expect of women?
I’m not sure what else you have to judge Lynne or me in other than our Expression of our POV?
HW— a light was shine on the turd. Expressly. How did you miss it?
It’s solid reasoning. You and Lynne think only men are toxic and you equal or exceed the toxicity of any man on here. No doubt that’s why he qualified it so.
How do you like me now?
HW, I do not think that only men can be toxic. I also don’t think that it is only men who can view a loss of privilege as oppression. Women are just as susceptible. You can see it in many feminist spaces when women of color call out white women for their racism and the white ladies act as if they are suddenly being oppressed when what is really going on is they are being asked to allow non-white women space to speak up.
HW– The men who dominate this blog are not representative of ‘all men.’ Thank god. It makes total sense that you think it does however. I mean, you believe some pretty wacked out shit and so do many many of the regular commenters here… but feminism and talking about white male privilege– that’s some weird ass psycho shit.
Yep, totally reflective of the general population’s spectrum of beliefs.
Thanks Satan.
You didn’t like my characterization of toxic femininity, Lynne. What are the aspects of it in your view?
An example of toxic femininity would be mean girl culture I guess. I seldom see boys or men engage in it. Maybe they do but I don’t notice? I have seen some women use social power to get pretty abusive. Usually towards other women though and sometimes men. Kind of like how toxic masculinity often leads to violence towards women and sometimes other men.
So men are more violent to women than other men. Huh.
Has Adolph Whitmer charged anyone with illegal gardening yet?
Some deep journalism on the woman at Michigan’s Operation Gridlock who said that we needed to stop the social distancing so that she could have her hair dyed.
Oh, and we were apparently right to suspect that these people were manipulated into putting their lives on the line.
I didn’t realize it was impossible to dye one’s own hair. The poor thing. How can we stand by and watch her suffer like this?
How do you know she didn’t stop dying her hair the moment she heard there was a highly contagious virus in Wuhan? She may have been acting decisively and early.
That’s odd. I didn’t see any of the GOP billionaires down there at the protests themselves. I wonder why.
The billionaires might just want to hire some attractive actors to pretend to protest next time…or at least remotely attractive….like they do on Fox News.
If my life depended on it I wouldn’t go near that bunch. Did you get a good look at them? Ick!
How many people have been ticketed for gardening? My projection is zero.
The stores are selling out of seeds and gardening supplies.
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