Trump, from the comfort of his New Jersey golf club, calls out the men and women of Puerto Rico for being lazy and ungrateful as they fight for their lives

Yesterday, a full 10 days after Hurricane Maria hit Puerto Rico as a Category 4 storm, the Mayor of San Juan, unsatisfied by the response of the United States government to the crisis being faced by her constituents, made the decision to go on the offensive. Calling out the “inefficiency” and “bureaucracy” that was preventing aid from reaching those in need, Mayor Carmen Yulin Cruz declared, “I am done being polite. I am done being politically correct. I am mad as hell.” And, shortly thereafter, wearing a t-shirt emblazoned with the phrase, “Help us, We are dying,” Yulin Cruz went on CNN to both challenge the positive assessment by Homeland Security Secretary Elaine Duke, who had referred to the government’s response thus far as a “good news story,” and demand that more be done for the people of Puerto Rico, who are still very much at risk.

Well, as you might imagine, this didn’t sit well with Donald Trump, who, as we know, tends to get angry when not being praised. And, this morning, he went on the attack, talking about himself in the third-person, and ranting about how ungrateful and lazy the people of Puerto Rico are, and how terrible a leader Yulin Cruz is. He sent these tweets out, it should be noted, from the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, New Jersey, where, it would seem, he’d gone to do a little golfing, and relax after spending a grueling few days lying to the American people about how the proposed Republican tax reform plan would “protect low-income and middle-income households, not the wealthy and well-connected”, when, in fact, it would actually do the exact opposite, raising taxes on the middle class, and putting trillions of dollars into the pockets of the 1%… Here, if you can stomach it, are a few of Trump’s tweets directed at the Mayor of San Juan and the people of Puerto Rico.

First, though, you should know that, as of right now, at least 16 people are known to be dead in Puerto Rico as a result of Hurricane Maria, and the subsequent losses of power, water, etc. According to a report just issued by CNN, now 11 days since Hurricane Maria hit, 95% of people are still without regular electrical service, only 10.7% of the island’s cell towers are operational, some communities are still completely cut off, and the likelihood of a full-blown public health crisis is growing rapidly. It’s also worth noting that the entire island is under a flash flood watch until late tomorrow, as yet another 2 to 4 inches of rain could fall, according to the National Weather Service.

So, yes, our President, when confronted by a humanitarian crisis impacting the lives of some 3.4 million tax-paying American citizens, chose to respond by saying that they should essentially pull themselves up by their bootstraps, and stop looking to the federal government for help. [Puerto Rico, for those of you who might not be aware, is an American territory, and the people who live there are American citizens.] And, as if that weren’t enough, he chose to attack the Mayor of San Juan for her “poor leadership.”

Can you just imagine what the response would be if Trump had said the same thing to the people of say, Connecticut, which is approximately the same size as Puerto Rico, after a natural disaster… if he’d told the people looking for the bodies of their loved ones that they should stop complaining about not having food and clean drinking water, and instead be more self-reliant?

I can’t wait to see what kind of greeting he and the First Lady receive on Tuesday, when they’re expected to visit Puerto Rico and assess the damage.

Here, for those of you who might be interested, is a photo of Mayor Carmen Yulin Cruz. In it, you can see her walking through the flooded streets of San Juan, checking on the health and safety of her constituents… And, yes, this is the woman who Trump attacked from his private golf club for having “poor leadership” during this crisis.

Russel L. Honoré, the retired lieutenant general who assumed command of the Hurricane Katrina response in 2005 after the initial federal effort proved inadequate, had the following to say earlier today on CNN… “The mayor’s living on a cot, and I hope the president has a good day at golf.”

But, this is how Trump responds to criticism, and he apparently didn’t like seeing the Mayor on CNN, telling Anderson Cooper, that, 10 days after the storm, there are people “drinking out of creeks in San Juan” and old, retired people “caged in their own buildings,” because Trump, for a week, refused to act, choosing instead to focus his attention on the fact that several NFL players had chosen to kneel for the national anthem.

Trump, in his defense, has explained that it’s not a trivial task to get aid to the island, due to the fact that it’s surrounded by “big water… ocean water.”

In conclusion, I’m sorry if it comes across as offensive, but, if, either by not voting, or voting for any candidate other than Hillary Clinton, you helped put this unstable, cruel and hateful monster of a man into power, fuck you. You have not only made our nation a laughing stock, and considerably weakened our democratic institutions, but you have put your fellow citizens in grave danger, and one can only hope that, one day, you are paid back in full for what you’ve done. This moment in history that we’re living through is not only terrifyingly awful, but it was also absolutely foreseeable. And, if you played any part in making this happen, especially if you still refuse to publicly accept responsibility, and actively join the resistance, you’re just a much a part of the problem as Donald Trump. The time to sit on the sidelines and hope that he evolves into a legitimate president, is over. We have all the evidence that we need.

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130 Comments

  1. wobblie
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 5:18 am | Permalink

    Why do you hate white woman so much, 51% voted for Trump. This is surely the way to build unity don’t you think? Trying to figure out how to convince my white christian sister that Trump and the Republicans are ruining our country seems much more important and constructive than wishing vile hateful things happen to her. After all she is very afraid in a world that has seen more and more of the anchors of her life disappear.

    Sounds like you are more interested in retribution. Not recognizing one’s own failures and blaming others is the haul mark of hubris (the definition of the National Democratic Party).

  2. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 10:42 am | Permalink

    You love spreading fascism around the world so fuck you, you globalist scumbag.

  3. ypsidoodledandy
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 10:45 am | Permalink

    Hmmm. There were multiple routes to failure with Hillary’s campaign. She won the national popular vote by several million votes but lost the Electoral College because she lost the popular votes in the states of Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, by a combined total in all three states of 70,000 votes.

    That’s right, Trump is President by a margin of 70,000 votes.

    “What Happened” to cause that result in these three states is NAFTA, WTO and 35 years of bi-partisan neo-liberal economic policies. I’m always surprised how many in my circles—highly educated professionals who have never voted other than Democratic– do not know what “neo-liberal” economic policies are, but in case you are wondering, Bill Clinton, Obama, Bush and Hillary all subscribe to and support neo-liberal economic policies, as does most of the Democratic party establishment. The Naked Capitalism blog has some pretty good explainers on neo-liberalism—look in the topics section.

    Paraphrasing a retired former President of an industrial union local in Pennsylvania who I heard on the radio, he said: “The union always endorsed the Democrats and we always followed the union, but the Democrats gave away our jobs. If Trump does 10 % of what he says about trade, that will be 100 % more than Hillary will do.” So after 35 years of having “nowhere else to go” in Presidential elections—Trump gave these voters a place to go, and they turned out.

    There are a lot of people I know who imagine everything would be “okay” if Hillary had won—and it would be for them—they have been unaffected by the declining economic options for most citizens in the US—and their headline issues of abortion rights, LGBT rights and environmental issues would be “taken care of” (and without them having to actually do any work or make any sacrifice to fight for those causes—bonus!). These same people think everything was “okay” under Obama, but for very many Americans that was not true (and even in areas such as civil rights, which should have been his forte, Obama was terrible—read Glenn Greenwald at the Intercept blog).

    And most of us buying non-union and foreign made products–with no thought to the environmental and human costs of said production–was an important contribution we each made at the individual level to the success of the neo-liberal economic project—well done you!

    The “progressives” who ride around Ypsilanti in foreign cars with “Buy Local” bumper stickers on them have finally reaped—for all of us, not just for themselves, unfortunately—what they sowed. I submit if you are going to “resist”, you need to understand what exactly needs resisting, and that is much broader than Trump.

  4. Posted October 1, 2017 at 11:00 am | Permalink

    Now Trump is telling the people of Puerto Rico not to believe what the lying press is telling them about what he tweeted yesterday.

  5. Posted October 1, 2017 at 11:13 am | Permalink

    Retribution? Yeah, I suppose so.

    I was writing this late at night, and I guess I let my anger get the best of me. The combination of his attacking the Mayor of San Juan, while, at the same time, displaying such ineptitude as a leader – talking about the “ocean water” that surrounds Puerto Rico – was just too much for me to take. So, yeah, I guess I forgot that I was supposed to be nice and respectful to those who helped put this man in power. I’ll try harder in the future… if there is one.

  6. Posted October 1, 2017 at 11:18 am | Permalink

    “You love spreading fascism around the world so fuck you, you globalist scumbag.”

    Are you talking to me? Are you saying that I love spreading fascism around the world? And how, exactly, do you get that from this post? It it fascism to expedite humanitarian aid to fellow Americans in their time of need? Because, really, that’s all that I was calling for in this post.

  7. Posted October 1, 2017 at 11:33 am | Permalink

    As for the Democrats taking the labor vote for granted, which, if I understand you correctly, is at the core of your comment, I agree.

    On the issue of foreign cars, I believe I wrote about it at length here back in the early days of this blog, but, when I bought my first “new” car, I wanted to buy from one of the big three. At the time, though, none of them were making hybrid vehicles. And it was important to to me to demonstrate that that there was a market for such cars in the United States. (The big three were focused on SUVs at the time, which I found to be both completely unethical and short sighted, given the realities of peak oil and global climate change.) So I bought a Honda Civic hybrid. And, now, I’ve stayed with Honda, having last year traded the Civic in for an Accord, which, by the way, at least according to this report, is the 2nd most “American-made” car available in the United States. So, yeah, the big three lost me as a customer back in about 2003, and I don’t feel bad about the decision, as they weren’t investing in the kinds of vehicles I wanted. And, now, it’s going to be hard for them to win me back, but Tesla might, if they can get their prices down.

    Here’s that article:
    http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/business/2016/07/09/1-honda-among-best-in-us-content-ranking-for-vehicles.html

    As for your bigger point about labor, though, yes… the Democrats need to get back to their core, middle-class principles.

  8. The Hill
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 11:51 am | Permalink

    General overseeing Puerto Rico response breaks with Trump: We don’t have enough troops or equipment http://hill.cm/qyQdgoX

  9. Jcp2
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    The Honda Accord may be #2 in terms of US content, but none of Honda’s US plants are unionized.

  10. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 1:13 pm | Permalink

    ““You love spreading fascism around the world so fuck you, you globalist scumbag.”
    Are you talking to me? Are you saying that I love spreading fascism around the world? And how, exactly, do you get that from this post? It it fascism to expedite humanitarian aid to fellow Americans in their time of need? Because, really, that’s all that I was calling for in this post.”

    Hell yes it is directed to you. You have no problem with Obama and Clinton spreading fascism as I detailed weeks ago and now you say fuck you to people who voted against Clinton. So fuck you. All the isms you think you are against are what you are.

  11. Anonymous
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

    Fascism: a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

    Reading that definition, HW, do you really expect us to think that Obama and Clinton fit the criteria better than Trump?

  12. Meta
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 4:16 pm | Permalink

    Conservative media is calling the San Juan mayor a terrorist.

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/914171181326102529

  13. Paula Owes
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 4:40 pm | Permalink

    Hey Mark, are you in the comfort of your home? Why don’t you stop criticizing the president and Help out all you can. Not critical negative writing. You could actively go to the PR island

  14. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

    Her support of Rivera Lopez is well documented.

  15. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 4:59 pm | Permalink

    Absolutely, anonymous. Obama and Clinton put neo-nazis in power in Ukraine. Hardcore violent neo-nazis. What has Trump done that is anything like that? He is for Americans of all colors as far as I can see. You think deporting people who entered illegally is racist or what? You think we would do well to have wide open hemispheric borders like Clinton? You want to dissolve USA sovereignty to create an American Union? In my view that would lead to the ultimate in centralization – a monolithic global government.

  16. Sad
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 7:12 pm | Permalink

    Are HW and DAY allies against International Village?

  17. Lynne
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 7:17 pm | Permalink

    Trump’s incompetence was completely predictable. There is suffering that would not have occurred if a more competent leader were in charge. Yes, the working class has been suffering too but not at the same level as Puerto Ricans. Wage stagnation does not excuse any rust belt voters who voted for jobs for white people at the expense of POC .

  18. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 7:21 pm | Permalink

    I kid around about how we should pay for it all, Sad but in reality I think it is too great of a change in Ypsi’s historic character.

  19. Eel
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 7:41 pm | Permalink

    How’s this for a headline?

    “After spending day at golf tournament, Trump dedicates trophy to the people of Puerto Rico”

    It really happened.

    https://goo.gl/wjp23C

  20. Posted October 1, 2017 at 8:04 pm | Permalink

    I’d love to join you, Paula, but I have a bone spur on one of my feet.

  21. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 8:05 pm | Permalink

    The governor said Trump has done everything they asked. More needs to be done he said but…more will be done. The San Juan mayor didn’t even meet with FEMA. Does she think wading around by herself without dealing with a broad relief effort makes a lot of sense?

  22. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 1, 2017 at 9:04 pm | Permalink

    “Trump’s incompetence was completely predictable. There is suffering that would not have occurred if a more competent leader were in charge. Yes, the working class has been suffering too but not at the same level as Puerto Ricans. Wage stagnation does not excuse any rust belt voters who voted for jobs for white people at the expense of POC .”

    Yeah, Hillary is so competent at handling disasters. That’s why she is so loved in Haiti. You are another one of those people who are not just wrong, but completely opposite of the truth. That last sentence you wrote is offensive to intelligence itself. No one thought “Yeah, ahma vote fer white jobs at the expense of the colored man!” Isn’t it embarrassing to say such dumb shit all the time?

  23. Iron Lung
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 11:49 am | Permalink

    People who voted for this shit bag can truly fuck off.

    People who voted for Jill Stein can also fuck off.

  24. Iron Lung
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 11:50 am | Permalink

    People who didn’t vote because “Trump and Clinton are the same” can also fuck off.

    People who didn’t vote because Bernie Sanders didn’t get the nomination can also fuck off.

  25. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 12:45 pm | Permalink

    Iron Lung,

    You missed a group that played a key role in the election results. Gee whiz, I wonder who you are leaving out? What other group might be responsible for Hillary not getting elected?

  26. Jean Henry
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 1:44 pm | Permalink

    HW– The Obama and Clinton supported neo-nazis in the Ukraine thing has already been handily de-bunked on an earlier thread. (They supported a fair and free democratic election process; an ultra right wing party won a few seats as has happened in every European country and ours in the time since) Why do you keep spreading lies?

    Your fear if Ypsi losing it’s historic character and charm (v concern for its fiscal functionality and affordability) is exactly what I’d expect of you.

    PS (related, not for HW) Why is it that so many socialists and marxists question the need/desire for raising government revenue, and dismiss it as greed? Isn’t that a bit short on concept of marxism or socialism? I’m wondering where they think funding for affordable housing development (or even just maintenance and preservation of existing stock + other critical govt services) will come from? That piece has been bugging me a lot lately.

    It seems every ideologue hates gov’t until they imagine themselves in charge.

  27. Jcp2
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

    Maybe because those that label themselves as socialists and Marxists are actually libertarians and anarchists in practice?

  28. Iron Lung
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 2:51 pm | Permalink

    “You missed a group that played a key role in the election results. Gee whiz, I wonder who you are leaving out? What other group might be responsible for Hillary not getting elected?”

    Oh yeah, I forgot.

    Michigan.

  29. Jean Henry
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 3:11 pm | Permalink

    JCP — nah. They hate the system, but they also care about the disenfranchised. The same can’t be said for libertarians. Anarchy maybe, but in my experience the main thing anarxhosts do is label themselves as such.
    It’s just distrust of government. Which I understand. Which is why I am as skeptical of alternative systems as I am of capitalism. In the end ones distrust of and frustration with the State must be balanced against the need for public solutions to some of our most intactibke problems. Unless they like private solutions… oh wait…

    Re localism and the big three: as a committed localist I want to make clear that supporting giant multinational corporations, even MI based, is NOT what the movement is about. It’s kind of the opposite of what it’s about.

    Also, Competition with the Japanese saved the big three. Until then they were bloated and co my bullies smashing any little guys with a better way of doing things. The Toyota LEAN systems thinking? Invented in Mi, passed u by the big three, taken up in Japan. Now its back here and has been adopted as SOP for auto manufacturing…

  30. Jean Henry
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 3:13 pm | Permalink

    Pardon bad phone auto correct pigeon english…
    Nothing I say matters anyway.

  31. Jean Henry
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 3:19 pm | Permalink

    Is FF the last man standing bemoaning the supposed neglect of the white working class? Pretty much everyone has let that go by now, after looking at trump voter data, the actual economic data on globalism and jobs and federal social program outlays and then the news from C-vile etc.
    It’s a discounted perspective now, FF.
    Didn’t you get the memo?

  32. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    “HW– The Obama and Clinton supported neo-nazis in the Ukraine thing has already been handily de-bunked on an earlier thread. (They supported a fair and free democratic election process; an ultra right wing party won a few seats as has happened in every European country and ours in the time since) Why do you keep spreading lies?
    Your fear if Ypsi losing it’s historic character and charm (v concern for its fiscal functionality and affordability) is exactly what I’d expect of you.”

    It doesn’t matter what you expect. Your debunking sucks. You call this shit fair and free. All you people are 100% full of shit all the time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYjsCJwcPWk

  33. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 5:04 pm | Permalink

    Jean,

    I don’t know why you have always wanted to boil my reason for people not liking Hilary and a core of her supporters down to neglect of the white working class….Think about it…Those are not words I have ever spoke….Those are your words….I really thought then and think now that you are participating in arguments with multiple “types” and on multiple social media platforms and it all gets muddled into misattributions….Anyway, I was just making a minor point. Many Democrats do not want to accept the role they played in helping to get Trump elected….Sorry, if I am sounding repetitive over 6 months but it amazes me that certain people don’t see their responsibility in this…Iron Lung’s curses on all others except his group are the most recent example of reckless and counterproductive arrogance. You followed up Iron Lung’s worthless, mean spirited,but mostly just dumb curses with misattributions in order to massage your compulsion to play the insane game of identity politics that failed (clearly) and will fail again (probably)….

    We can do better.

  34. Lynne
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 5:32 pm | Permalink

    Yes FF we know what you mean. Uppity women and POC nominated a really qualified person for president who happens to have a vagina and then we acted all entitled to that shit. But you white guys sure put us in our place. So yes, fuck you too. You are exactly why we have Trump.

  35. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 5:47 pm | Permalink

    It has been such a pleasure getting to know you people.

  36. Jean Henry
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 6:37 pm | Permalink

    FF We had many lively conversations here after the election about the neglected WWC and my refusal to shed any tears for them. (Which is mostly rhetorical; they are not the marginalized. They are simply most concerned with preserving their own privilege, which includes and outsized influence on electoral college results) im sure you can look it up if you want. I remember it well enough. Don’t need to go back.

    I’m here in Whitmore Lake now surrounded by the WWC. Not having any issues, except that they all leave for work and hit the highway as early as I do (7am) which is a bit of a disappointment. Bonus though is the steady smell of woodsmoke and sound of heavy metal drifting through the tree cover and insect cacophony. It’s a lot like car camping up north. Plus cool activities like this fundamentalist Christian alternative haunted house– http://nazhauntedhouse.com
    Haven’t been to one since I was a kid.
    They do not seem to be suffering in any way that is unique from other working class people. Same drugs and alcohol, same hard work and limited resources. Most seem to be doing ok unless they fall prey to substance abuse, like most people. Their politics just make them assholes. Or fools. I guess we all can fall prey to that too.

  37. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 7:19 pm | Permalink

    I love how you get logically slaughtered and then just pretend it didn’t happen like an embarrassed pussy cat, Jean.

  38. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:16 pm | Permalink

    Hyborian Warlord, what is your real name?

  39. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:22 pm | Permalink

    You dont have to answer, of course. It is just really weird that so few peoople are willing to put their names out there.

  40. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:44 pm | Permalink

    I don’t want these hostile idiots knowing who I am. They want to attack everything and everyone true because they can’t believe they are so very wrong – even when it is in their face. In a time of universal deceit it is dangerous to tell the what, Maria?

  41. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:51 pm | Permalink

    Universal deceit? Hyperbole. I wish there was more untruth to the news.
    It has been been just horrendous lately, hurricanes, earthquakes and more.

  42. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:53 pm | Permalink

    CBS executive, Hayley Geftman-Gold wrote:

    “I am actually not even sympathetic because country music fans often are republican gun toters.”

  43. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 8:55 pm | Permalink

    That is awful.

  44. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 9:29 pm | Permalink

    Don’t you think they spin everything? CNN and MM were harping on Melania’s shoes for example while Trump’s relief effort seemed to go relatively well.

  45. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 2, 2017 at 9:33 pm | Permalink

    Literally everything Jean Henry says is the opposite of the truth. Can you watch the video I posted and agree with her that it was free and fair in the Ukraine in 2014? That is some 1984 shit to say that. Come on.

  46. Iron Lung
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 12:13 am | Permalink

    The comments section of this site is crazier than ever.

    I recommend bringing back tatersalad.

  47. Iron Lung
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 12:18 am | Permalink

    “CNN and MM were harping on Melania’s shoes for example while Trump’s relief effort seemed to go relatively well.”

    You vastly overstate the reach of Mr. Maynard’s site. I like this site, too, but comparing it with CNN is a bit much.

  48. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 3:28 am | Permalink

    Yeah, and you are no “Hayley Gold”.

  49. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 6:08 am | Permalink

    It’s funny to hear people like you try to say the truth is crazy then back it up with sarcastically superficial bullshit, iron lung.

  50. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 6:14 am | Permalink

    Do I think CNN spins everything? No…Jake Tapper for instance I think tries to be accurate and expository at the same time.

  51. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 6:55 am | Permalink

    But Tapper is one of the main ones pushing the “no evidence for wiretapping at Trump Tower” claim. Now it comes out that Manafort, who lived there and communicated with Trump was in fact surveilled. That’s only one of the many Americans associated with and including President Trump that were spied on for political reasons. The truth is completely the opposite of what Tapper says.

  52. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 7:06 am | Permalink

    Well, you know, I wasn’t there, I can’t comment on that whole thing. I saw him interview Hillary Clinton and I thought he did a good interview.

  53. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 7:14 am | Permalink

    You weren’t there so you can’t comment on it…Fine by me as long as you hold yourself to the same standard when it comes to everything else in this world.

  54. Sad
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 7:44 am | Permalink

    You don’t own any weapons do you HW?

  55. POLITICO
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 9:09 am | Permalink

    Puerto Rico has the potential for a worsening public health nightmare two weeks after Hurricane Maria barreled it http://politi.co/2fI9Nc9

  56. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 9:12 am | Permalink

    “You don’t own any weapons do you HW?”

    Typical MM-type smeary insinuation

  57. ypsidoodledandy
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 11:30 am | Permalink

    Thanks, Mark, for your response.

    As far as the car purchase piece, I was trying to make a distinction between union and non-union US made—there have been US, union-made Mazda’s, Toyota’s, VW’s, Mitsubishi’s, etc. at various times in the last 30 years. Good news though—if your Honda was assembled in the US, it has at least a few US, union made parts in it! And you hopefully bought it at Fisher Honda here in town, so that supports a local business!

    I was upset when Sesi abandoned its Ypsi location, but maybe they still pay taxes on the empty land. We do still have Butman Ford, but I don’t know if that is in the city limits. We can’t overlook the negative local impact of the Ypsilanti Ford plant closing—we still have a lot of retirees from there, but the good jobs it provided for ordinary people (of all races and genders) in the community are gone.

    The union—non-union distinction is important for elections because unions spend huge amounts of resources educating their membership and retirees about economic issues, and in turning them out to vote. The UAW, for example, negotiated federal election days to be paid holidays, to make it easier for workers to go vote.

    At non-union employers, this obviously does not happen.

    There is no perfect purchase. You obviously gave it serious thought and chose the environment as your paramount value in purchasing a vehicle, and that’s fine—I never tell anyone what they should do, only ask that they are fully informed about the possible consequences of their choice. One consequence of weak unions is Trump.

    I submit if the UAW were as large as it was 30 years ago, and as influential (due to negotiating good contracts) with its members and retirees, Trump would not have won Michigan by 10,000 votes. And the same for industrial unions in Wisconsin (margin 20,000 votes) and Pennsylvania (margin 40,000 votes).

    I don’t know why the unions continued to endorse neo-liberal Democrats over the past 30 years—perhaps the theory of “lesser evilism”–but they did, and they endorsed Hillary too. Maybe the big auto companies also endorsed the two Clintons and Obama—they certainly should have based on their economic policies.

    As an aside, my mother just purchased a Ford C-Max Hybrid small wagon, union assembled down the road in Wayne, Michigan. It can be done, it just depends on your priorities.

  58. Jean Henry
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 1:30 pm | Permalink

    Ypsi Doodle: How quickly we forget. MI went to union busting Regan in 1980 based largely on the defection of WWC union voters: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election_in_Michigan,_1980

    No neo-liberals to blame. Just racism as a more powerful motivation than their own self-interest. White Union members were disaffected by the growing diversity and inclusivity in Union ranks. Until the 70’s Unions could be counted upon to systematically oppress people of color. I’m very pro-organized labor, but let’s not indulge nostalgia to the point of delusion.

    Bethlehem Steel had a factory in my hometown growing up. My parents were very involved in local politics and remember them shutting down any new business development in the area, in order to preserve their dominance politically and to secure their labor base. Most new businesses went to surrounding counties. My home county, 40 years later, long after the Steel Plant closed, is still a poor, underemployed neighbor to its successful neighboring counties with diversified economies.

    I don’t tell people what to buy either, but there is nothing about loyalty to US car companies that relates to the localism movement. Localism is about not having too big to fail companies dominate our economic health, well-being and fate. Or our labor movements.

  59. Lynne
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 3:35 pm | Permalink

    I think both Clinton and Obama can better be called Keynesian than neo-liberal, which usually means the kind of laissez-faire macroeconomic policy favored by libertarians. It doesn’t refer to anyone who isnt a socialist. And it definitely doesnt mean “less liberal than I like”

  60. Lynne
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 3:37 pm | Permalink

    I also find it odd that people are suggesting Clinton lost because her positions arent socialist enough. Yup, that is why those union guys have been voting Republican for decades. riiiiiiight

  61. Jean Henry
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 5:56 pm | Permalink

    Scrolling through the presidential results, it appears that you have to go back to 1968 to see Michigan going for a Dem (Humphrey). The next time they went Dem was 1992, for that ‘neo-liberal’ Clinton. So much for labor’s influence on presidential election results.

    PS Lynne I agree with your assessment of the Clintons as Keynesian. The way I understand it calling them neo-liberal equates them with supply side economic theories, which is convenient politically but inaccurate. You know more than i do about this. I just see neo-liberal applied to dismiss any private sector solutions, which seems naive at best.

  62. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 8:04 pm | Permalink

    Well HW…that makes no sense and I
    am not sure why you think I am looking for your approval.

  63. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 8:29 pm | Permalink

    I honestly quit paying attention to Russsiagate months ago.

  64. wobblie
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    HW seems to be detached from reality when it comes to Puerto Rico, much as Bush was concerning Katrina when he said what a great job Brownie was doing.

    Jean, one of the reasons the wwc detest liberals is because when ever we vote against those who have screwed us (which as often as not are Democrats) the liberal shouts racism. You state, “psi Doodle: How quickly we forget. MI went to union busting Regan in 1980 based largely on the defection of WWC union voters”.
    Union busting is bi-partisan. Carter (the last decent man to leave the White House–I don’t say occupy) was just as much a union buster as Reagan,
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1978/03/07/president-invokes-taft-hartley-act/27a103ed-6f58-41c6-bfac-48e65f1ee7aa/?utm_term=.9f2438ac6a62

    Both Republicrats and Demolicans use racist dog whistles when it suits them. I think Ypsidoodle’s comments were right on. He implicitly connected how neo-liberal policies have impacted us locally. Once upon a time (not so very long ago) we made things here in Ypsilanti. We were supported a number of local car dealers, people (even poorly educated working class folks of all races) had some money in their pockets. We were a factory rat town with a university when I moved here.

    24 years of Neo-liberalism has reduced us to seeking hand-outs (lets hope we get them) from rich foreigners.

    Neo-liberalism was invented by the Democratic Leadership Council which wanted to keep the Democratic party from becoming Progressive. They champion “liberal” identity political issues which arose out of the failure of the Equal Rights Amendment, while at the same time championing austerity and corporate control.

    That is why Bill Clinton gave us the revoking of Glass Stegal and the elimination of aid for Families with dependent children (you know welfare–one of the three stools upon which our social security system was built). Why Obama gave us shit for a jobs program while assisting the banks while they foreclosed on millions of us.

    Neo-liberalism is the ideology of Empire, you know that Jean. It is how we can continue to prosecute our endless wars–you know the ones we elected Obama to stop.

  65. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 10:06 pm | Permalink

    “Well HW…that makes no sense and I
    am not sure why you think I am looking for your approval.”

    What makes sense about what you said: “Well, you know, I wasn’t there, I can’t comment on that whole thing”?

    You weren’t at Trump Tower when they “tapped” the “wires” or what? You can watch Tapper talk about it just like you watched the interview you liked. Then you can watch him squirm when the truth came out.

  66. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 3, 2017 at 10:16 pm | Permalink

    “HW seems to be detached from reality when it comes to Puerto Rico, much as Bush was concerning Katrina when he said what a great job Brownie was doing.”

    You people make so many flat statements it’s like you exist in only two dimensions. Tonight on Fox they said there were sixteen people who died during the storm and the number has not gone up since. Haven’t you figured out you lose every time against me? It’s hard to believe – I know, but it is true.

  67. wobblie
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 4:11 am | Permalink

    And this morning it is now 31. Anyone who is connected to reality knows the number will be larger yet. Great job HW.

  68. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 5:26 am | Permalink

    How many died in Katrina, dork?

  69. Sad
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:14 am | Permalink

    Sticks and stones….

    You do have a weapon, your cutting wit!

  70. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:25 am | Permalink

    I was going to mention that but hopefully it is obvious even to the brain-dead. It’s funny how you desperately cling to my trash talk and ignore the factual point.

  71. Sad
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:41 am | Permalink

    I get it – Trump is great- there are conspiracies and wrong doing by democrats. Is that the point?

    Give me a break, I’m ….Sad.

  72. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 9:03 am | Permalink

    And a whole shit ton of people on here lie about it and pretend it is the opposite. Quick quiz: how many refrigerated containers of goods are waiting for Puerto Rican drivers to deliver them and how long have they been at the port?

  73. kjc
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 9:23 am | Permalink

    “Trump’s relief effort seemed to go relatively well.”

    saying the opposite of what’s true might not be something you’re against.

  74. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    “saying the opposite of what’s true might not be something you’re against.”

    The worst you have is Melania’s shoes!

  75. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 10:09 am | Permalink

    Harvey claims lives of more than 75 in Texas
    Most of 50 victims in greater Houston area drowned

    http://www.chron.com/news/houston-weather/hurricaneharvey/article/Harvey-Aftermath-Houston-police-officer-dies-19-12159139.php

    Now I seem to remember criticism of the (democrat) Houston mayor for failing to call for evacuation. So most of the deaths were preventable but due to poor leadership (sound familiar?) a lot of people died. It’s still a small fraction of the Katrina episode so in fact it went relatively great. I understated it by a lot.

  76. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 10:38 am | Permalink

    Harvey doing pretty damn well against Obama’s Sandy too. Would have been much better if mayor Turner had done his job right.

    Wikpedia: Sandy fatalities‎: ‎233 total (direct and indirect)

  77. Lynne
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 11:26 am | Permalink

    Re: “PS Lynne I agree with your assessment of the Clintons as Keynesian. The way I understand it calling them neo-liberal equates them with supply side economic theories, which is convenient politically but inaccurate. You know more than i do about this. I just see neo-liberal applied to dismiss any private sector solutions, which seems naive at best.”

    Yes, that is exactly it. Most people who use the term “neo-liberal” seem to just use it to dismiss any private sector solutions as perfectly illustrated by wobblie’s ignorant post above. It actually has a very specific economic meaning but as our language changes, perhaps for not much longer. I think it will just become a mostly meaningless insult. It already has probably. Certainly the way wobblie is using the term is not consistent with its meaning regarding macroeconomic policy.

    He is right that *Bill* Clinton was a pretty economically conservative president especially for a Democrat but seems to fail to see that was a response to 12 years of WWC voting that demanded such things. A more liberal Democrat would not have won. And fwiw, I think Bill Clinton’s presidency was a good example of the good that can come in such a climate by accepting something less than one’s ultimate goals in certain political climates. I wouldn’t even call Bill Clinton a neo-liberal although he is certainly closer to it on the spectrum of economic theory than his wife or Obama are.

  78. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 12:11 pm | Permalink

    Even after acknowledging, that the meanings of terms change, you still feel confident calling Wobblie’s comment “ignorant”? I can guarantee you that every person who has ever taken a course in economics knows that the term “neoliberal” has different meanings–because the different meanings of the term is an obstacle to classroom discussions and the different meanings of the term is an obstacle that **must** **always** be addressed in a class room setting. Congrats, you at least had one class that studied Keynes and Friedman. One would expect that you be in an advantaged position to distinguish different meanings when in dialogue, no? Wobblies is not using the term as an insult. Wobblies descriptions now and at other times, which incorporate the term “neoliberal”, do so in a way that is somewhat main stream but consistent with one of the alternative meanings, no?

    Did you forget the first thing your Econ processor talked about the first week of classes?

  79. kjc
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 12:28 pm | Permalink

    “Most people who use the term “neo-liberal” seem to just use it to dismiss any private sector solutions as perfectly illustrated by wobblie’s ignorant post above. It actually has a very specific economic meaning but as our language changes, perhaps for not much longer. ”

    this seems like total bullshit honestly. who are you reading? and who are these “most people”?

  80. Lynne
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 1:28 pm | Permalink

    FF, his post was totally ignorant. And fwiw, my background in Economics is greater than just one class but whatever. I am not at all surprised that you would assume that I am less qualified than I am since you seem to tend to do that to women. You are such a dick!

    I am sure you have all sorts of advanced degrees in the field and thus are able to accurately judge my knowledge on the subject. But yes, you are right. I will acknowledge that changing meaning of the word and that it now means “not as socialist as I would like” or “has some belief in private sector solutions” because that is really how it is being used these days. I do need to accept that the meaning has changed and no longer refers to the libertarian small government sort of policy that I associate it with.

    And yes, of course I remember what my econ professors said in those early classes. Mostly “incentives matter” if you care to know. I am sure, however, that different professors emphasize different things.

    kjc, for an example see wobblie’s post above but I see this all of the time. People very often claim that HRC is neo-liberal for instance when she very much is not. I see the far left constantly using this term. I used to ask people what they thought it meant and never was able to get much of an answer although sometimes people would google it and then I would ask them to specify which policies of Obama’s or what in HRC’s platform fit the bill. Mostly, I got *crickets* but occasionally someone would come up with a specific policy that maybe could fit but only if taken out of context of the larger body of their policies.

  81. wobblie
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 2:58 pm | Permalink

    I am a practicing economist Lynn. I’ve written hundreds of firm specific economic analysis of the effects of foreign competition on that firm and its workers. Since the advent of the neo=liberal trade policies championed by Democrats such as Clinton, Obama, and yes Hillary too, my expertise has been much in demand. Everyone of my analysis’s is subjected to rigorous examination by Government regulators. In the end every one of my analysis have proven to be correct.

    My use of the term “neo-liberal” is quit correct. And my explanation (brief that it was) of the origins of that term is also correct.

    Modern class room economics is all about obscuring economic relationships. There is hardly another academic discipline that has whored itself out so completely to the oligarchy as economics.

  82. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 4:50 pm | Permalink

    Lynne,

    You have it all twisted around and backwards.

    I am not assuming you are uneducated about economics–exactly the opposite–actually. I am assuming that you know quite a bit about economics based upon what you have written. I am, however saying that even a person who took one economics class would almost certainly be aware of the different uses of the term “neo-liberal”. Therefore, someone in your position,who I assume has taken several econ courses, should, better than most people, know not to call Wobblie’s comments “ignorant”. Wobblie’s usage of the term is different than your usage but Wobblie has been consistent here and in previous posts where he used the term and it did not just boil down to him using it to throw around an empty insult as you suggested.

    Wobblie was trying to share a relevant perspective that had recognizable content; Whereas Lynne is the one throwing out an empty insult.

    FF is not the one assuming Lynne is less educated than she is about economics because of some underlying sexist view Lynne falsely imagines FF has. (Nice accusation though! ) Lynne, however, is the one assuming she has authority over the meaning of a term, entitling her to belittle other people, whom she perceives to not have been initiated in the same academic process she has gone through—Probably due to some underlying classism on her part….

    FF sexist? No.
    Lynne sexist? Yes.

    FF classist? No.
    Lynne classist? Yes.

    (The suggestion that I have an underlying desire to assume you only took one economics in college is just so ridiculous–yet perhaps indicative–of the types of things that you find important when judging others.)

  83. Jean Henry
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 5:07 pm | Permalink

    Because I was interested last winter, during the election, in the morphing of the term neo-liberal from Referring to Milton Friedman’s supply side economics and Reaganism and Thatcherism to referring to globalist liberals, I asked around and was told this book was the key factor in opening the floodgates among leftist scholars to use the term for Clinton. It’s good andnot surprisingly extremely ideological in its critique.
    https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/undoing-demos

    It’s worth noting whenever a word changes meaning as part of a political debate. We certainly needed a term to refer to liberals who were not protectionist. The globalist/protectionist divide is real in both wings of politics. But when that word is the same term used by neo cons (andin the same decade as Clinton’s presidency), its use is meant to equate two dissimilar political perspectives as essentially the same-/ something the left loves to do to in order to muddy the waters and present their way as the only way.

    Most People who use the term neoliberal have no idea what the word means. They aren’t using it right in either meaning. They just think it means bad and greedy. They know it makes them feel righteous. Ideology-fueled ignorance on the left always makes me more sad than on the left. It just robs me of all hope for workable solutions to inequity ever. Period.

  84. Lynne
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

    Wobblie, then by all means, explain how a candidate who strongly supports expanding programs like medicaid and social security can reasonably be called “neo-liberal” in the economic sense you are using it. It really sounds to me like you are using it in the “not as liberal as I like” sense that has become the more common usage of the word.

    FF, give it a rest. You clearly were suggesting that I only took one econ class. That is BS. And yes, I find you quite sexist based on many things you have said here. I will admit to classist biases, btw and perhaps my pet peeve about the most recent usage of the word “neo-liberal” reflects that. I KNOW that my pet peeve about the misunderstanding of the Robert Frost’s The Road Not Taken does which is of course why that scene in Orange is the New Black about it especially resonated with me. We all have our biases. Yours is that you are a little bit sexist even if you don’t see it.

  85. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 6:10 pm | Permalink

    Lynne. Wrong. I am not assuming anything here. I remember you talking about having an interest/ background in economics before, on mm.com….

    Now you are saying I am spewing “BS”? Why would I? Do you really think I, or anybody here has some kind of vested/ underlying interest in believing you have not taken more than one econ class? Lol. (This is so weird.)

  86. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:04 pm | Permalink

    HW. I dont follow Russia gate .

  87. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:24 pm | Permalink

    I dont know if he is helping in Puerto Rico, since I am not there ..he tends to encourage groups to try and do more for.themselves and how well he understands the linits of various groups capabilities is not clear.

  88. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 7:35 pm | Permalink

    Russia Russia Russia has been Jake Tapper’s mantra for a while and you said you think he is a good journalist… Just saying he has been extreme in his propagandistic zeal and it is backed up by jack shit. To fill you in there has been no evidence of collusion produced to date and Trump was in fact being electronically surveilled through government spying on Paul Manafort, who lived at Trump Tower and talked to him regularly.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sO35YvxxRtA

  89. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 8:01 pm | Permalink

    The ports are full with supplies. Only a small amount has been delivered because of a number of reasons including a fuel shortage, bad roads and few drivers able or willing to work.

    Trucker’s Union Frente Amplio leader Victor Rodriguez

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeUjUCAKWOI

    Summary from https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/09/30/puerto-rico-teamsters-union-frente-amplio-refuse-to-deliver-supplies-use-hurricane-maria-as-contract-leverage/

    Labor union head Victor Rodriquez is complaining about a law that the governor passed three weeks ago.

    The reporter CONFIRMS that the truck drivers are refusing to work in order to get revenge on the governor.

    Rodriguez says that the governor’s policies have impacted truckers, so now truckers will show the country THEIR OWN suffering.

    The reporters says, “But all this stuff is in the past. In the present, it’s an emergency.”

    Rodriguez guy says that the country can now experience what the truckers experience due to the governor’s policies.

    Rodriquez says the truckers are not responsible for helping the country. That’s the governor’s job.

    Three weeks earlier, nobody cared about the plight of the truckers, so now the truckers don’t care about the country.

    This is all the governor’s fault, Rodriguez says. He passed a law, and now he has to live with it.

    The governor didn’t understand the suffering of the working man, so now the truckers will show the country what suffering is.

    Since the country doesn’t care about truckers, the truckers won’t help.

  90. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    Tje union leader speaking said they have told the truckers.to go to work and some roads are impassible..

  91. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 9:26 pm | Permalink

    That’s all he said? I am far from fluent in Spanish.

  92. Frosted Flakes
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 9:36 pm | Permalink

    I found someone translating it in the comments section of YouTube. According to the commentor on youtube–the main gripe was they did not have enough fuel to fill trucks and filling was not happening quickly and that going through FEMA created time consuming red tape for picking up and distributing the goods. It sounds like the trucker was giving explanations for why he and other truckers were unable to move the goods efficiently and quickly. Another problem was communication between truckers/ destinations/pickup spots.

  93. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 4, 2017 at 9:56 pm | Permalink

    Maybe that is a way of saying they refuse to go through FEMA.

  94. wobblie
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 4:24 am | Permalink

    Blame the victims it is the American Way

  95. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 5:32 am | Permalink

    You mean victims of nature, right? Because the US government has them loaded with supplies.

  96. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 5:39 am | Permalink

    The first thing that the man says, is that the truckers are doing what they are supposed to be doing, the person who isn’t doing what they are supposed to be doing is the governor. Okay?So the reporter asks him, What does the governor have to do? then the man responds, the governor has to go to work, like the truckers, who by 6 in the morning the truck of (unintteligle to be me) was here. Ask that of all these people (gestures with a sweep of the finger to the crowd behind him) who were here at 6 in the morning. He asks twice the crowd, tu habia camion por aqui (you was the truck here) affirmitives are heard. The reporter than says, well, good, why then does the governor have to why does the governor have to ask that the truckers have to report to work?

  97. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 5:51 am | Permalink

    to which the older gentleman says..which is the least he can do is reproach the truckers, because the governor just passed a law, on top of everyone, trying to liquidate the truckers, with permission. The reporter says, no, no, no, no. It is okay to do a law, but we are in an emergency.What you are trying to say respectfully, you are fighting with the governor, not going to work,for a law!…to which the older man says. no,no,no,no,no, we are doing what we have to do….and the reporter interrups him and says, you just said for a law! no..unintelligble. then emphatically, the truckers are going out to work (los camioneros estan saliendo a trabajar!)

  98. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 5:52 am | Permalink

    and I will stop here.

  99. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 6:17 am | Permalink

    Well that’s reeeally fuckin’ different then what you said last night.

  100. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 6:53 am | Permalink

    ?

  101. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 6:54 am | Permalink

    Impassable not impassible.

  102. Jean Henry
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 6:55 am | Permalink

    Thanks for the translation Maria.
    HW– Maybe show some gratitude. And no it’s not so different. It’s entirely possible that the roads were impassable and there was not enough access to fuel. Two things can be true at once. What’s clear is the governor tried to blame it on the Truckers union. And you liked that take, because it confirms your ideological perspective. And Maria just made it clear, via greater knowledge than yours, that you were fooled. So much for independent thinking, much less being right.

  103. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:33 am | Permalink

    Obviously the roads are fucked up. The point is it is inadequate to say “Tje union leader speaking said they have told the truckers.to go to work and some roads are impassible..” It sounds like the union is blaming it on the governor so that is weird for you to say the opposite.

  104. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:39 am | Permalink

    The governor has to go to work meaning he has to meet their demands or they won’t do what they are supposed to. He admits there are drivers ready to go. Somehow the legislation passed in weeks prior to the hurricane is a sticking point.

  105. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:40 am | Permalink

    I have no idea why you thought that.

  106. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:40 am | Permalink

    What he said was the truckers are going out to work.

  107. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:43 am | Permalink

    I don’t know how many showed up, how many stayed long, and how far and how much they manage to deliver in a shift. I don’t know what roads are still impassable and I don’t know why they are arguing.

  108. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:54 am | Permalink

    http://www.independentsentinel.com/puerto-ricos-suffering-with-roving-gangs-teamsters-who-wont-drive/

    While there is no formal strike, Mr. Rodriguez appears to be exploiting the tragedy to gain ground in contract negotiations. A law passed in August by the governor has them particularly upset and the unionists say it accommodates Uber and Lyft to their union’s detriment.

    That legislative measure is known in Spanish as “el proyecto del Senado 525 que da paso a la Ley de Transformación Administrativa de la Comisión de Servicio Público” or simply “el Proyecto del Senado 525.”

  109. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 7:58 am | Permalink

    No matter what it is absolutely disgusting to see mayor Cruz point to an empty warehouse and decry Trump while Puerto Rico’s ports are full of goods.

  110. Maria E. Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 8:01 am | Permalink

    Oh. you are mad at that mayor.

  111. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 8:12 am | Permalink

    Why should everyone not be mad about Cruz lying to attack the president who has done more for their benefit than they can handle? How could you not be furious that the truckers are stalling to exert pressure on the governor to rescind a law they don’t like?

  112. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 8:50 am | Permalink

    Because I am not there, I don’t know how accurate any of this information is. People get angry…that part I don’t get upset by as easily as others, I think.
    And whatever all the caterwauling is about, there is no doubt that Puerto Rico took it on the chin with that hurricane.

  113. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 8:55 am | Permalink

    There are motion pictures you can watch in your own home of thousands of containers waiting in port. Just compare that to what the mayor has said. That’s about all you need to see it is total bullshit.

  114. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 10:45 am | Permalink

    “Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 8:58 am | Permalink
    yes, the mayor of San Juan is angry with Trump. Probably the hardest days of her life to date has been since that hurricane. She might be mad for a long time.
    If a person was from say, Italy, how accurate is mlive to describe what happens here?
    The press can try and explain things but sometimes, unless a person is there, it is hard to know..and arguing about the cost of delivering fuel..well, I would expect some haggle from a union guy. but not a lot. That is just me.”

    Noticed you posted this in the other thread, Maria. Why should Cruz act like Trump’s aid has been practically non-existent when Puerto Rico can’t get it together to distribute the immense supplies he has delivered?

  115. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 11:50 am | Permalink

    Go ask her.

  116. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 12:12 pm | Permalink

    Oh, okay. I’ll just pop down there and ask her… If you don’t want to talk about her lies then don’t justify her anger.

  117. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 12:19 pm | Permalink

    Let us know what she says.

  118. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 12:46 pm | Permalink

    Well, durt de dur!

  119. Durt DeDur
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 1:00 pm | Permalink

    Hey buddy, leave me out of this!

  120. Jean Henry
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 2:38 pm | Permalink

    So what you are saying. HW, is that political leaders of all stripes will exploit a tragedy to their advantage? That they will present a perception of any given scenario gaining widespread public attention that validates their own ideology??
    That’s a shocking revelation.
    It’s a wonder that a prominent denizen of the internet like yourself could not have encountered such a scenario before, even among common citizens.

  121. wobblie
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 4:40 pm | Permalink

    I am going to go with what Gen. Honore (ret) the man who was called into rescue the Katrina relief effort, has to say. He as been on the ground in Puerto Rico.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgdomxmdEB4
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PZtwhk8vsI
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AD0Eg98xCG0

  122. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 6:48 pm | Permalink

    I am not saying that at all. Why do you say shit like that? It’s called a straw man. You always do it.

  123. disinterested observer
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 11:22 pm | Permalink

    Jean Henry to HW: “And you liked that take, because it confirms your ideological perspective. And Maria just made it clear, via greater knowledge than yours, that you were fooled. So much for independent thinking, much less being right.”

    This is my impartial opinion. Jean is right. Warlord is wrong. Warlord seems to be susceptible to conspiracy theories.

    http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2017/oct/03/blog-posting/fake-news-posts-blame-puerto-ricos-truck-drivers-r/

  124. Iron Lung
    Posted October 5, 2017 at 11:49 pm | Permalink

    Warlord is clearly not a warlord at all, but a dedicated follower of a would be dictator.

  125. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 8:27 am | Permalink

    Greater knowledge of Spanish, sure. That’s nothing special though. If anything it was less clear after Maria’s befuddlement.

    I could debate all of you at the same time and easily win. If the roads and communication is so bad that the ultra-willing PR truckers simply cannot do their job why are the US teamsters sending people to do the impossible? http://money.cnn.com/2017/09/30/news/teamsters-union-puerto-rico-hurricane-maria/index.html

  126. Sad
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 8:33 am | Permalink

    HW – can’t wait to see what you’ll take pictures of this weekend.

  127. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 8:38 am | Permalink

    “Warlord is clearly not a warlord at all, but a dedicated follower of a would be dictator.”

    Whoah – strong shit, dude! How am I ever going to recover?

  128. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 8:44 am | Permalink

    “HW – can’t wait to see what you’ll take pictures of this weekend.”

    Didn’t know I was contributing to the effort. If you want to know more about Ypsi you should get to know me in real life ’cause my roots are deeper than probably anyone who posts here.

  129. Maria Huffman
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 8:03 pm | Permalink

    It might be easier, HW, to follow what was happening if you did speak Spanish…maybe some truckers are looking out for their families given the situation there.

  130. Hyborian Warlord
    Posted October 6, 2017 at 9:34 pm | Permalink

    I don’t need to speak Spanish to know that. That’s one of the first things I heard like two weeks ago.

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